Hmm, looks like my little thread has got some action.
![Grin ;D](https://ironcrown.co.uk/ICEforums/Smileys/default/grin.gif)
I think because of those of us who come from an ICE RPG background (I teethed on RolemasterSS, though we ignored most of the rules) we are used to having math in RPGs.
There are lots of other RPGs that don't even use "math", and achieve the same goals (taking the role of a character).
Look at White Wolf and the New World of Darkness lines. The only math in the game is a subtraction or addition of the number of dice you roll. Everything else is looking at dice you just rolled and seeing if there are any 8s, 9s, and 10s.
Look at BRP, and the other D100 roll under mechanic games (which there are plenty). These have a slightly more amount of math (double your skill, halve your skill, or perhaps add a small amount to your skill before you roll under) but then you roll under and see if you succeed.
I think the D20+Skill (with the stat added in already) comes next.
Then I think the D100 + skill comes in above the D20 version. Sure, you are adding the same amount of things together, with slightly larger numbers, but for some people, this, and this alone, is the reason they won't touch a game. And as a person that sadly can't play in many games that I like, I'm forced to try to run them for other people that I can convince to try it out. I'll do what I have to, to get them to play. I've had the most success with having people try a D20 version of HARP, than all of my other attempts using the rules as is.
For me, if I am having trouble converting players (mainly from D&D) and I can find a way to entice them over with lower numbers (and other house rules that remove more math, such as ignoring the -25 penalty for no ranks) then I'm all for it.
For those that have never tried to convince D&D players to convert, it is MUCH harder than you think it would be. Many people have a loyalty, that passes reason, but I guess most of it is nostalgia, and the name. Many people have had lots of fun over the years and associate that with the name. Sadly, some have not had as much fun with crunchier rules, and therefore associate those feelings with the games we grew up playing.
For me, math doesn't have to be in my RPG. I love a lot of storyjamming / story games that rarely use math either.
Am I a stupid guy, am I a smart guy? I think I'm slightly above average to be perfectly honest, but there are some players that are a little slower, and should we discriminate against them, if they prefer to use systems with no math, or less math? Like I said, I'm used to it, but others aren't.
To be perfectly frank, I think I love about 75% of HARP. For the last 25%, I house rule it, and use the HARP D20-Fied download.
I fully believe math doesn't need to be in a RPG to achieve its aims, but I don't have a problem using RPGs that use math either. Like everything else it comes down to taste, nostalgia, and what you can actually get other people to play. I have lots of RPGs that I've never played or ran, because I'm the only one I know that likes them...
Sadly, I wasn't able to entice anyone to play HARP (even the D20 version) at our local gaming convention in Pittsburgh (GASPcon), but I still passed out the books I bought to some RPG players that came for the 1st time.
I think some of the pro D100 posters have been a little harsh in how they've worded their strong feelings. Maybe they perceive some slight against what they love so much, and have hurt feelings.
I had no intention of angering anyone. D20 works better for me, and D100 works great for most of you, and that's perfectly fine for me.
I'm not going to force-feed you spicy foods because I happen to like them. But don't tell me I'm an idiot for liking food that makes me sweat.
![Wink ;)](https://ironcrown.co.uk/ICEforums/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
I play RPGs to take a little mental vacation from Real Life that has a tendency to kick me in the head every day. I need the escape. For me it doesn't matter if that escape needs math, numbers, pennies, or whatever the mechanic is for that game. I play and run games to have fun, interact with old and new friends, and forget about the dark cloud above my head for a few hours at a time.