Topic: Nobility?

[dutch206]

I'm currently working on converting the Greyhawk setting to Rolemaster.  I'm setting my first adventure in the Yeomanry, which is a democracy.  So, the quick answer would be:  "So what if you're a noble back home?  That and two bits will get you a beer." 

[RandalThor]

I'm currently working on converting the Greyhawk setting to Rolemaster.  I'm setting my first adventure in the Yeomanry, which is a democracy.  So, the quick answer would be:  "So what if you're a noble back home?  That and two bits will get you a beer." 

First: I would love to see what you do there, GH is my favorite "typical" D&D setting. (Dark Sun is my all-time favorite D&D setting.)

Second: Nobles are likely to still be treated with some level of deference in that situation, maybe sort of like diplomats. Even in America royalty from other countries are well treated - so long as they are wealthy, that is.

[GrumpyOldFart]

I'm currently working on converting the Greyhawk setting to Rolemaster.  I'm setting my first adventure in the Yeomanry, which is a democracy.  So, the quick answer would be:  "So what if you're a noble back home?  That and two bits will get you a beer." 

IIRC, a "full meal" is likely to be only a dime or so, so my first thought is, "Man, you guys have expensive beer in your world."

 

[intothatdarkness]

I'm currently working on converting the Greyhawk setting to Rolemaster.  I'm setting my first adventure in the Yeomanry, which is a democracy.  So, the quick answer would be:  "So what if you're a noble back home?  That and two bits will get you a beer." 

One of the guys who used to GM with us did this. Greyhawk works pretty well with RM2, actually. Which makes sense, since one of the purposes of early RM was to replace elements of D&D for gaming groups.

[markc]

I'm currently working on converting the Greyhawk setting to Rolemaster.  I'm setting my first adventure in the Yeomanry, which is a democracy.  So, the quick answer would be:  "So what if you're a noble back home?  That and two bits will get you a beer." 

One of the guys who used to GM with us did this. Greyhawk works pretty well with RM2, actually. Which makes sense, since one of the purposes of early RM was to replace elements of D&D for gaming groups.

 I agree fully.
MDC

[providence13]

We're in the Theocracy of the Pale/Phostwood and another under the Vesve/Iuz (Drow Vault, Against the Giants-backwards.)

The groups are just learning about nobility in both campaigns. It means different things to everyone.

[dutch206]

*OFF TOPIC*
I am setting my campaign in the Yeomanry Freeholds in the hex occupied by the town of Westburn and the foothills of the Crystalmist mountains.  I am using 0one's version of the "Caves of Chaos" as a first adventure. 
Also in that hex:  an underdark tunnel known as "the bore", which the Suloise used to escape the Twin Cataclysms.

*RESUME TOPIC*

[providence13]

*OFF TOPIC*
  I am using 0one's version of the "Caves of Chaos" as a first adventure. 
*RESUME TOPIC*

ON TOPIC; related. 
  I used the same maps. With the "Keep" (0One's version of "the Borderlands") being controlled by a seneschal/castilian until the Lord returned. It was hard for the PC's to arrange a meeting with the guy in charge because of their lower standing. They had to clear some of the caves and rescue miners from Kobolds before they merited a face to face meeting; social standing increased/bonus on reaction roll.
  My reasoning for the dissimilar creatures living so close to each other also involved a bit of social standing. Priests of Iuz were recruiting "monsters" to live in the area to cause chaos (ha!), starting with the Keep. Naturally,the pecking order was a "might makes right", but also involved who was more involved with the Old One (Iuz). Because the Kobolds provided the most intel, they actually had more pull with the Priests than the Minotaur, Orcs, etc. Although they knew not to challenge these stronger foes directly.

Eventually, the Drow were involved. So many demons were tied up in a Hellwar, that Iuz's had less shock troops to invade past the Vesve. Lolth, Demon Queen of Spiders (Drow God) allowed some of her hellspawn to gate in to assist Iuz. If the PC's can shut down the gates in the Drow city, this will greatly hinder the Old One's advance.
 The group is having a tough time among the Drow, because they are of a 'lesser race' and all male; female Drow are the dominant sex. Currently, they have an equivalent social standing of escaped slaves.

When Iuz pushed the Horned Society (collection of Orc, Ogre, Brigand lands) into the Shield Lands, the Knights of the Shield were all but destroyed and scattered. For the few remaining Shield Knights, people of the surrounding area look down on them for not being able to hold the line; lower social standing.

[RandalThor]

Also in that hex:  an underdark tunnel known as "the bore", which the Suloise us

You me Slerotin's Tunnel. Slerotin was the Seul mage that made the tunnel.

[bpowell]

Back to the posted topic....

I have been running the Campaign World I use for more years that I should admit too.  Over that time I have come up with ways of dealing with most player requests.  By using what we like and discard what did not work we have come up with a world that seems to work, although it can be a bit complex.  I require a background to be written for ALL characters.  Most of the time this is a paragraph or two...just enough to give me some nice hooks.

First off I make a hard distinction of the following attributes for a character:

Noble - Related to the rule class.
Citizen - Having certain responsibility and privileges in the land.
Reputation - How well know/liked/feared you are as a character.

I allow the "Noble" talent.  Then I cross reference this with an old Judges Guild table (modified) to see where you rank on the Noble structure.  Most Nobles are way down the list and are the offspring of what amounts to a landed knight in Franco-Anglo history.  But they may get (un)lucky enough to be directly related to the ruling family.  If you take this be ready to write a LARGE background (two pages).  If the player decides not to be a noble they can re-roll the talent or I might allow them to pick one mutually agreeable.

To become a citizen one must server the Empire, normally a 4 year service n the Legions. (Yes, the world is pseudo Roman.)  All males are encouraged to do this.  Only citizens may own land and businesses and can vote or serve on councils.  While females are not pushed to become Citizens (it is Rome after all), some do accepting the requirements and privileges incurred.  Non-citizens can live rich full lives working in shops or on farms.  They are protected by law.  They are taxed (if free men) but have no say in how those taxes are spent. 

Service in the Legion is not necessarily fighting.  The Legions build roads, service aqueducts, and do other maintenance operations in the Empire.  In a 4 years stint a potential citizen might never seen a weapon drawn in anger.

Citizenship is not required, but in noble families it is expected.  A son (or daughter) can refuse to become a citizen, but they are then considered to not be of the Noble class.  This means the Noble class is somewhat fluid with some families dropping out and others joining.

Reputation is an arbitrary factor assigned my....ME!  If you were a noble born person  you might start higher on the scale that the normal "Common" born.  If one wishes to play a character that was born of low class they may.  This allows for the person that can level a whole village to have some distinction in the game.

There are some perks to being a Noble.
1)  Access to others of Noble rank.
2)  Higher starting funds and access to some "family" money.
3)  Higher starting repuataion..."Isn't that the Baron of Dungheaps child?"

There are some drawbacks.
1)  Penalties for illegal activities are MUCH harsher.
2)  Expected to serve the Empire, if they do not they are seen as an outcast.
3)  Accepting a whole set of social obligations at the whim of the family (again....ME!)
4)  Taxation at a higher rate.  Many Noble are expected to pay a set amount yearly, and this could be more than a Common Man's family can make.

Some players decline, others (my wife) have it thrust on her.

[markc]

 I am using the idea (thought testing) that the Noble class is somewhat fluid in nature. That is to say that it is possible to move up, down and out of the Noble class. But I am still trying to work out the logistics of it all.
MDC

[intothatdarkness]

I am using the idea (thought testing) that the Noble class is somewhat fluid in nature. That is to say that it is possible to move up, down and out of the Noble class. But I am still trying to work out the logistics of it all.
MDC

One of the cultures in my world does this through a form of "nobles' council" where titles can be given and taken away based on activities of the families that possess them. It's a mix of clergy and scholars, judging the families against the ideal standards of the society. Granted, this is a small culture with only a handful of realms in the entire continent, but that does allow them to exercise a sort of social control over nobility. Titles are passed down, but they can be stripped by the council if the family behaves in a way contrary to the code. Likewise, a commoner can earn nobility through their deeds.

One of my larger cultures operates more on the purchase system. If you have enough "readies," you can buy a title and become noble. Obviously the newcomers are looked down upon by the older families, but it's still a system they all understand. Their conduct is going to be shadier than the previous one, since the cultural underpinning is quite different. In fact, in that area some of the shadiest folks ARE nobles.

As you may have guessed, I like having a pretty wide spectrum of cultural differences in my world.

[bpowell]

Isn't tat the way it normally is?  The Noble have access and the means to dodge the consequences if they are caught.

[intothatdarkness]

Isn't tat the way it normally is?  The Noble have access and the means to dodge the consequences if they are caught.

Depends on the context and setting. In my first example, a noble is stripped of title and land if they're caught messing up. It's a culture thing there. The opposite extreme is represented by the other example. Of course, there are cultures in my world that lie between the two extremes. And when you get into the more tribal cultures, nobility takes on a slightly different meaning. There it's often a question decided purely by blood...if you're descended from one of the original champions of the gods, for example, you're a noble. In others it can be driven by occupation...if you're a shaman you're part of the "noble" circle.

[markc]

  In my game it is a 3 way system Nobles keep the Democratic Gov. and Business in line, sort of like the the three branches of power in the US Gov. And the other 2 keep the Nobles in line.
MDC