Author Topic: Question about the fly spell  (Read 1366 times)

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Offline Ruffie

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Question about the fly spell
« on: November 20, 2020, 07:30:39 AM »
(English is not my first language, I'll try my best)

One of our party members is a mage and he really likes the fly spell. There is also the skill "flying" in RMSS. Now our mage always tries to do the most ridiculous maneuvers while flying. He likes to hang upside down in the air and stretch out his arm so that he is within distance to get an extra bonus on his spellcasting (range mod)

Now my question is:
What kind of mobility etc does the fly spell give you? What guidelines should we use to see what kind of maneuvers he has while in the air?

Offline markc

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2020, 12:58:24 PM »
In general the fly skill is it you have wings not for using the flying spell.


(I have the combat skill name wrong as I am away from my books right now)

Most people use acrobatics skill to make any/most maneuvers while flying and some also require combat (flying) to fight while flying, sort of like the skill that limits OB and skill, skill bonuses on horses during combat.


General notes:
1)Anything that is too unbalancing for you game should be taken a look at for general game balance and over all group fun.
2) Anything the player can do so can the enemy.
3) Flying requires a % of activity in most games (no official rule) so it limits other actions.   


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Offline Spectre771

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2020, 01:25:00 PM »
I'm also not near my books, is the flying spell a concentration spell in RMSS?  At the very least, it's movement during combat and movement of any sort takes up action percentage per turn which would impact percent action for combat/spell casting.

Flying skill in RM2 is as markc stated, for being on a flying animal (Roc, Dragon, Air Elemental...) as Riding skill is for being on an animal (horse, donkey, really big duck...)  I can only recall one player having an Elemental Mage (air) and he had flying, but it was when when I first started playing RM2 in 1989 and I was more focused on learning the game.  I can't recall how the GM handled flying for that mage.

For game balance for your "super flying mage," any time he wants to do a maneuver, assign it a difficulty and have him resolve it on the Movement/Maneuver table first.   He'll start to rethink is crazy actions soon enough.  That table has been the Great Impartial Resolver of All Conflicts for us. :)

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Offline markc

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2020, 01:47:43 PM »
Sorry I forgot some stuff,


1) This is a common asked question and doing a search of the forums might give you some good info for your game.
1a) I do not remember any official rule in RM1-2 or RMSS/FRP for this issue, besides the suggestion of using acrobatics for general maneuvers and combat Flying to limit other skills while flying.
1b) A number of times people were going to write articles and submit them to theGuildCompanion.com but I do not know if that was done.
1c) I do remember one person saying they were going to use some rules from D&D 3.XX in their game but I do not remember exactly what they were.




General Notes:
1) Concentration: I do not remember right now but it might be a good idea to do some serious playtesting and or add flying actions to a % activity chart to provide penalties to actions.
2) Moving Maneuvers: In general, like you would if a caster was running, jumping, etc you should adjust the casting maneuver accordingly to actions taken.
Thus: Horizontal layout, head rolling, arms flailing should be a penalty to most actions in RM (except maybe acting in a comedy to get laughs).
3) IMHO this topic could have 2-30 pages or material written to try cover all the possibilities of this unique area of combat, just like underwater combat, blind combat, space combat, any some I probably forgot.   
Now that I think of it maybe look at SM:P and how they do space/weightlessness actions/combat for ideas. I do not remember them well enough right now to comment.


MDC
 
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Offline Spectre771

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2020, 02:04:17 PM »
Just grabbed RMC-II.

Per the skill description (paraphrasing) any maneuver done while Flying/Gliding incurs a natural -75 to the maneuver roll.

Your upside down Mage has a -75 to try to fly upside down while casting a spell.
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Offline Spectre771

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2020, 02:07:06 PM »

2) Moving Maneuvers: In general, like you would if a caster was running, jumping, etc you should adjust the casting maneuver accordingly to actions taken.
Thus: Horizontal layout, head rolling, arms flailing should be a penalty to most actions in RM (except maybe acting in a comedy to get laughs).

Heck, I'm still laughing now! :D

Quote
Now that I think of it maybe look at SM:P and how they do space/weightlessness actions/combat for ideas. I do not remember them well enough right now to comment.

MDC

Brilliant!  That would offer some great insight and certainly offer some ideas for dealing with the topic.
If discretion is the better valor and
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Offline markc

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2020, 02:53:54 PM »
Flying spell casters has been an issue as people forget land based people have the combat skill (land combat) at enough ranks to not get any penalties for an non-native environment.


In the past people on the forums and in person have told me many "perfect maneuver" flying spell caster stories and how they have tried to deal with it.
Unfortunately I do not remember them all and using acrobatics and combat (air) does not solve all the issues...but it does cost more DP and often involves more rolls thus making it more difficult at lower levels and skill ranks.


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Offline Ecthelion

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #7 on: November 20, 2020, 05:58:19 PM »
Now my question is:
What kind of mobility etc does the fly spell give you? What guidelines should we use to see what kind of maneuvers he has while in the air?
If a (non-magical) warrior wants to fight from horseback he needs to learn Riding plus the Mounted Combat skill. In the same manner your flying mage might be required to learn Flying plus an Aerial Combat skill. Just a thought.

Offline rdanhenry

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2020, 01:53:45 AM »
Does the character carry and use a tape measure? Because the only way I could see any point to that stunt is if he's claiming the range to target from his fingertips and range from archers to his torso, but you cannot eyeball with that precision, even if range could be that exact over a round of combat. You're the same distance from your foe as your foe is to you, so all hanging upside down does is make you look silly, your pockets empty themselves, any loose clothing fall down (possibly obscuring vision), and your blood rush to your head (manageable for one round but if maintained too long, goes from a healthy change to a potentially fatal situation).
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Offline markc

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2020, 11:31:25 AM »
a) IIRC there are spells that can give you distance to something or you can use spell mastery to alter a spell close to it to do what you need it to.
b) Hanging upside down can be willing and or unwilling and players should secure their equipment accordingly, even if they are just running or walking unbalanced load issues can cause problems.


I have seen in games I have played in and or watched at a store or con a lot of different uses or flying or I should say players and GM's using flying in interesting ways.


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Offline Ruffie

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2020, 06:28:56 AM »
Thank you all for your replies. Let's see how he handles the acrobatics of the situation.

Offline markc

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2020, 08:25:22 AM »
Just Acrobatics will not give them Qu to DB in the air, for that you need the combat skill for air combat, like the skills for mounted combat, underwater combat and in SM zero-g combat.


This just may be 1 rank to get full DB bonus but that amount of DP means that DP are not spent in other areas.


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Offline OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol

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Re: Question about the fly spell
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2020, 05:42:56 AM »
What kind of mobility etc does the fly spell give you? What guidelines should we use to see what kind of maneuvers he has while in the air?
Except for physical combat (for which I'd use the AC's airborne rules section 7.4, p64, because of the inertia counter-force effect), I'd just do as if the recipient of the fly spell were on ground, with the spellcaster (or, possibly, the spell's recipient himself) needing to concentrate in order for him to move. Just use his normal DB, etc. I mean, the fastest a fly allows one to go is, at level 17, about 30 mph… which is slow in fly speed standard. People have been hunting and shooting for ages way smaller and faster targets than a human-sized one flying at 30 mph so one is hardly a threat.
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