Author Topic: New Spacemaster Setting?  (Read 4620 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline EltonJ

  • Adept
  • **
  • Posts: 489
  • OIC Points +0/-0
New Spacemaster Setting?
« on: November 07, 2023, 05:34:17 PM »
Would anyone like to see a new Spacemaster setting? I've been reading some of the books for Spacemaster: Privateers, and I'm wondering if I could do something different.  I have GURPS Space (4th Edition, and 3rd Edition).  And I have GURPS Biotech (4th Edition).  Oh, I have GURPS Time Travel too. hehe.  :D

I won't be using Time Travel, but I could use GURPS Space and GURPS Biotech to make something up.

Offline GrumpyOldFart

  • Navigator
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,964
  • OIC Points +0/-0
  • Hey you kids! Get out of my dungeon!
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2023, 07:03:11 PM »
Personally I think the SM1/2 Imperium setting was superior to the SM:P setting. The only thing I liked about SM:P was Letters of Marque and Reprisal. That one game concept is worth keeping, but the rest of it can be thrown away IMO.
You put your left foot in, you put your left foot out... Traditional Somatic Components
Oo Ee Oo Aa Aa, Ting Tang Walla Walla Bing Bang... Traditional Verbal Components
Eye of Newt and Toe of Frog, Wool of Bat and Tongue of Dog... Traditional Potion Formula

Offline Hurin

  • Loremaster
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,422
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2023, 10:50:33 PM »
I also liked the Space Bears.
'Last of all, Húrin stood alone. Then he cast aside his shield, and wielded an axe two-handed'. --J.R.R. Tolkien

'Every party needs at least one insane person.'  --Aspen of the Jade Isle

Offline MisterK

  • Senior Adept
  • **
  • Posts: 749
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2023, 11:38:09 PM »
I also liked the Space Bears.
You likely have played Space Opera (or Other Suns, but SO is more likely) too much :D

Offline Hansuke

  • Neophyte
  • *
  • Posts: 76
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2023, 08:08:42 AM »
I like the SM1/2 setting; especially with all the intrigue that the various houses provide. I do like several things in SM:P, mainly the more defined tech level charts and how they impact what you can build.

Offline Hurin

  • Loremaster
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,422
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2023, 08:56:30 AM »
Yeah, SM:P did tech levels better too. I think they also gave a bit more background on the races, which was helpful.

I like the SM2 setting better overall though.
'Last of all, Húrin stood alone. Then he cast aside his shield, and wielded an axe two-handed'. --J.R.R. Tolkien

'Every party needs at least one insane person.'  --Aspen of the Jade Isle

Offline David Johansen

  • Wise Elder
  • ***
  • Posts: 836
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2024, 03:23:52 PM »
I wrote up a bit of a setting and some races for The Guild Companion back in the day.

"The Covenant Generation" deals with tensions between The United Nations and Corporations of Earth and the Covenant, a colonial offshoot largely settled by various wealthy religious groups.  The other species are the Gryph, a race of feathered velocoraptors with large, colourful, and aggressive males and small brown females who get the work done.  The Inheritors of Gnar, genetically altered humans who's ancestors were traded with the dying race of genetic masters The Gnar for the secret of FTL.  The Dagonites an eight limbed race from a high pressure acidic world who were involved in a genocidal war with the Gnar and do not like visitors.  The Sheth, a race of reducing scavengers that look like big, fuzzy, eight limbed muppets but that "mouth" is actually their closed night vision eye, their mouth is on their belly, and the fur is thick symbiotic mold.  Nicholas might still have access to the files.  I might have something on my hard drive but it's about half a dozen hard drives ago.

Offline jdale

  • RMU Dev Team
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,234
  • OIC Points +25/-25
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2024, 03:35:43 PM »
System and Line Editor for Rolemaster

Offline Rose

  • Neophyte
  • *
  • Posts: 22
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2024, 11:49:32 PM »
Agreed on the SM1/2 setting. Never could get into the SM;P setting. Just ran the older setting with the newer rules.
The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.

Offline David Johansen

  • Wise Elder
  • ***
  • Posts: 836
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2024, 08:37:59 AM »
The SPAM setting was pretty under developed.  The Races and Cultures book helped but the setting was also deliberately narrow, there were no new races outside known space, there was no option to expand the setting beyond the war.  The author may have had ideas along those lines but they never reached the reader.

Honestly, it'd make a great wargame setting.  You've got the big nations fighting the big war.  You've got seven races for sub factions in the broader sides.  You've got Defiance all bombed to bits with every Tulgar in known space pining away to go and fight a hopeless battle against incredible odds.

Offline MisterK

  • Senior Adept
  • **
  • Posts: 749
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2024, 10:32:57 AM »
Honestly, it'd make a great wargame setting.  You've got the big nations fighting the big war.  You've got seven races for sub factions in the broader sides.  You've got Defiance all bombed to bits with every Tulgar in known space pining away to go and fight a hopeless battle against incredible odds.
Yes, and in my opinion, that is the main difference between a wargame setting and a flexible roleplaying setting. Both need potential for conflict, but conflict and war are not the same. The SM2 setting was ripe with conflict with multiple antagonistic factions jockeying for power, but the setting was flexible because war was only an option, and a localised one at that. There was a huge frontier, and the beyond. It had potential for many different types of campaigns. Settings that are based on a military conflict are intrinsically much more limited.
I don't know if I should blame Star Strike and Armored Assault for Space Master's drift towards a militaristic setting, but that would not be the first example of a RPG that drifts because of a related wargame [I'm looking at you, Privateer Press].

Offline David Johansen

  • Wise Elder
  • ***
  • Posts: 836
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2024, 07:19:48 PM »
ICE's intention was that the Privateers setting be very easy to set up and play.  You knew the PCs were privateers trying to stem the tide of a losing war with an evil empire.  The races were intended to be very relatable and easy to get into.  I think the rules don't lend themselves to that style of play.  At the very least the game should have included half a dozen pregen characters if that was the goal.  I think the story parts added little to the setting and the pages would have been better spent by including the skills and professions from Future Law.  An introductory adventure would have helped too.

Oh well, the whole thing was done while ICE was on the verge of bankruptcy and I don't think some of the decisions were well thought out.  The racial characteristic modifiers are really off.  A Falaron is larger than a human but has a lower Strength bonus?  The Valesians are very logical but have a crippling Reason modifier.  Honestly, the Valesians are barely playable characters.  It's a cool concept but it's a one trick pony and the trick is child eating murder hobo.  I've ran two short campaigns of it and I love so much about it but it's a very hard sell for players.

Offline Cory Magel

  • Loremaster
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,665
  • OIC Points +5/-5
  • Fun > Balance > Realism
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2024, 08:08:35 PM »
I'd just default to the Star Wars universe.  Firstly, because I can just put everyone off in some corner of it that I can do what I want for as long as I want before introducing more 'Star Warsy' stuff, but also because I have a crapload of source material for it.
- Cory Magel

Game design priority: Fun > Balance > Realism (greater than > less than).
(Channeling Companion, RMQ 1 & 2, and various Guild Companion articles author).

"The only thing I know about adults is that they are obsolete children." - Dr Seuss

Offline MisterK

  • Senior Adept
  • **
  • Posts: 749
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2024, 12:42:13 AM »
I'd just default to the Star Wars universe.  Firstly, because I can just put everyone off in some corner of it that I can do what I want for as long as I want before introducing more 'Star Warsy' stuff, but also because I have a crapload of source material for it.
Interesting - if I wanted another set of rules to play in the Star Wars universe, SM would probably be near the back of the line. I guess my Star Wars point of view has been shaped by WEG's d6 system a bit too much.
Conversely, if I wanted another setting for the SM rules, I'd probably use Traveller's Imperium.

Offline Hurin

  • Loremaster
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,422
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2024, 01:12:35 AM »

Conversely, if I wanted another setting for the SM rules, I'd probably use Traveller's Imperium.

That's an interesting idea. What is the Traveller setting like? It always looked kind of interesting to me.
'Last of all, Húrin stood alone. Then he cast aside his shield, and wielded an axe two-handed'. --J.R.R. Tolkien

'Every party needs at least one insane person.'  --Aspen of the Jade Isle

Offline Cory Magel

  • Loremaster
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,665
  • OIC Points +5/-5
  • Fun > Balance > Realism
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2024, 11:26:56 AM »

Conversely, if I wanted another setting for the SM rules, I'd probably use Traveller's Imperium.

That's an interesting idea. What is the Traveller setting like? It always looked kind of interesting to me.
If I recall correctly you can die during character creation. :)
- Cory Magel

Game design priority: Fun > Balance > Realism (greater than > less than).
(Channeling Companion, RMQ 1 & 2, and various Guild Companion articles author).

"The only thing I know about adults is that they are obsolete children." - Dr Seuss

Offline rdanhenry

  • Sage
  • ****
  • Posts: 2,615
  • OIC Points +0/-0
  • This sentence is false.
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2024, 01:15:54 PM »

Conversely, if I wanted another setting for the SM rules, I'd probably use Traveller's Imperium.

That's an interesting idea. What is the Traveller setting like? It always looked kind of interesting to me.
If I recall correctly you can die during character creation. :)
Character creation is a minigame, where death is a way to make it "press your luck" and prevent everyone from starting as very experienced, very old persons.
But character creation is part of the rules, not the setting, so not really relevant to the question.
Details somewhat depend on the edition, but it has wolf people and lion people, so if the anthros were what turned you off Privateers, you probably won't like Traveller.
Rolemaster: When you absolutely, positively need to have a chance of tripping over an imaginary dead turtle.

Offline Cory Magel

  • Loremaster
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,665
  • OIC Points +5/-5
  • Fun > Balance > Realism
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2024, 04:37:52 PM »
But character creation is part of the rules, not the setting, so not really relevant to the question.
And yet still funny.
- Cory Magel

Game design priority: Fun > Balance > Realism (greater than > less than).
(Channeling Companion, RMQ 1 & 2, and various Guild Companion articles author).

"The only thing I know about adults is that they are obsolete children." - Dr Seuss

Offline David Johansen

  • Wise Elder
  • ***
  • Posts: 836
  • OIC Points +0/-0
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #18 on: October 13, 2024, 03:27:24 PM »
Death in character creation is a feature not a bug, without it the game balance goes right out the window.

Okay, Traveller's Third Imperium in a nut shell.  Bear in mind that the Traveller fans will rend you like wild beasts if you conflate the setting with the system.

300000 years ago an alien race achieved sentience and technological advancement never seen since.  They went to Earth and transplanted humans on dozens if not hundreds of worlds.  They also uplifted wolves and transplanted them coreward and trailing.  To this day there's some debate over whether Terra is really the human world of origin but it is the best candidate in known space.

6000 years ago, the humans of Vland developed anti-gravity and warp drive and began their slow and methodica explorations that would lead to the first imperium.  The Villani are beaurcratic and fussy and their technological development stagnated quickly.

2500 years ago the Villani first encounter the Terrans who are expanding rapidly and have surpassed the Villani technolgically.  A series of interstellar wars eventually leads to the collapse of the First Imperium and the establishment of the "Second Imperium" or "Rule of Man" which lasts maybe 200 years.

The 1000 year long night ends with the Sylean Federation expanding by selling new technologies to their neighbours.  The technocratic entrenures take on tradition noble titles and call their new nation The Third Imperium.

1000 years later the Third Imperium is a sprawling giant bounded on all sides.  If there is one rule to sum up the Third Imperium it's "don't impede trade or the megacorporations will eat you alive."

The Third Imperium encompasses many sentient species but those who achieve FTL "Jump Drives" on their own are accorded special status as "Major Race" they also are the major political entities that neighbour the Imperium.  The Vargr are a nebulous race uplifted from Terran wolves by the ancients.  Their nations seldom last more than a couple generations but they are numerous and aggressive.  The Villani are part of the Third Imperium and are a major force for conservatism.  The Aslan are descended from carnivorous pouncers and are somewhat lion-like.  The K'kree or "Centaurs" are a herbivorous hexapedal race of militant vegans who will kill you if you have meat on your breath.  They control an empire of 1000 worlds and get on poorly with all their neighbours though they won't be picking a fight with the Hivers again any time soon.  The Hivers resemble starfish with one limb ending in another starfish.  They are inscrutible, technologically advanced, and supported by their militant I'thkulr client race on the field of battle.  The Hivers are master manipulators and the only designation or honorific in their society is "Manipulator."  The I'thklur national sport is baiting the Hivers with absurd behaviours, like playing baseball and wearing Santa Claus hats.  (there, that should set off any Traveller fans)  On the spinward and coreward end we have more humans, the utopian, psychic, Zhodani who have a society ruled by psychics where criminals are treated with mind wiping and everybody is happy all the time, or else.  They've fought five frontier wars with the Third Imperium and nobody really knows why.

Technologically Jump Drive and Anti Gravity are relatively simple technologies that we should be developing around next Saturday.  Ancient artifacts like forcefields exist but are rare.  The jump drive currently maxes out at six parsecs a week and that requires 60% of the ship to be fuel.  This makes space travel relatively cheap and easy.  Psionics exist but are banned in the Third Imperium.  (which makes finding a psionic institute a solid adventure pull)  There are no other FTL communications though research into long range telepaty is on going.

Offline jdale

  • RMU Dev Team
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,234
  • OIC Points +25/-25
Re: New Spacemaster Setting?
« Reply #19 on: October 13, 2024, 10:56:25 PM »
Although it has a lot of humans, and some anthropomorphic races, Traveller also has some really well done aliens. To me, personally, alien perspectives are one of the best things that the SF genre offers, and I thought they did that well. At least based on the original edition, I never kept up after that.

I think the mini-game style of character generation is great if what you love is making characters and maybe less great if you want to play an RPG. I made a lot of characters but I don't think we ever played much actual Traveller.
System and Line Editor for Rolemaster