Author Topic: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom  (Read 1613 times)

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Offline Crivens

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Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« on: September 14, 2020, 04:46:19 PM »
Hi all

I am studying the different Shadow World supplements to compile most of the stuff in an unique big mindmap.

After reading the stuff on Namar-Tol (Emer Atlas II), I realized that a few information are missing:
- what is the total population ? It is said that there are 5000 Loari patricians and there are 20% of Loari on Namar-tol. So if we consider a total of 6000 Loari (some Loari don't belong to a Patrician Family). Using this, can we consider a total population of 30 000 ?
- Do we have the stats of some people of note ?

And I have almost the same question for Nuyan Knom :
- total population ?
- military forces composition ?
- Stats of people of note ?

Don't worry if the stuff is not already existing somewhere, I will create it.

See you

Crivens
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Offline Siltoneous

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2020, 04:13:54 PM »
I worked on a story arc set in Nuyan Khôm recently, so some of the info is fresh.  There isn't much on Nuyan Khôm, other than the Emer Boxed set (6100?), and Emer II (6120).

From Emer I (pg 34, of the boxed set):
   Political Structure: Feudal Monarchy.  Two Dozen lords (Tarns) rule city-states.
   Military: All Tarns maintain a *small* defense/police force.
   Favorite weapon: Mace, but the broadsword is also commonly used.
   Excellent Bowyers and they use Composite Bow's.

Emer II:
   Population: TE 6022: 1/3 of the population died from plague.
   Professional Knights: Mataru are trained in a variety of Martial Arts (some can stand against Changramai). Referenced in Emer II also (1262/158 TE Timeline Entry): "Not only are the Nuyani better horsemen but they are skilled in a style of unarmed combat unknown to the Emerians."
   Bonded Knights: Mataru-Khin exchanged sons from one Tarn to another.
   Horses: in TE 5650 "...another horse plague sweeps the continent, killing vast numbers."   Now, using standard population growth rates (I've done some calculations), it's possible herds could have recovered fairly quickly. But....
   Gryphons: 'ridden by Elite knights' as referenced in the TE 5651 "Emer II" entry.

Non-Canon:
Maps:
There are a few maps floating around that show the political boundaries of Nuyan-Khôm, but I've never seen anything official. I think I found them using the Wayback Machine for the French site "clarn-celeonet-fr". Most of the Emer maps for the Nuyan-Khôm areas.... well... lack good detail. I say that as two clans specifically (White (Lahryan) and Turquoise (Lohniyan)) live on the Eastern side of the Ash Mountains /Sharksteeth and from looking at the official maps, you'd never believe it.

I've done some work on the maps surrounding Nuyan-Khôm. Mostly cleaning them up, and joining different pieces.  There is a 'NE Emer' image floating around, but it's hard to locate. Vromfogle had it at one time, and I think the matthatt site did too.  IIRC, it's the uncut version of the maps for NE Emer that show up in Emer II.  (On a side note, I've heard referenced in the forums of a COMPLETE Emer map somewhere that the NE Emer images were grabbed from.  Good lord, I'd pull my CC out at warp speed if it ever became available).

Adventures:
There is some excellent non-Canon stuff found in Waterfall City. (*) It's all in French, but I was able to use Google Translate to get it over to passable English.  Some damn impressive work done there, let me tell ya. I think the site was "http://mathhatt.free.fr/jdr/rm/sw/waterfall_city/". Again, mostly grabbed through the Internet Archives.

Tis what I know.

Silt

(*) I think the user here on the forums (mathhat) is the same person behind it. Just saw the name pop-up in another topic today. =D
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Online Hurin

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2020, 04:59:56 PM »
(On a side note, I've heard referenced in the forums of a COMPLETE Emer map somewhere that the NE Emer images were grabbed from.  Good lord, I'd pull my CC out at warp speed if it ever became available).


I have a realms of Emer map which shows the political boundaries of the whole continent, superimposed on 'The Great Continent' map that I think was in the Emer books. I have no idea who made it. PM me if you want to take a look.
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Offline RandalThor

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2020, 08:24:17 PM »
There is a 'NE Emer' image floating around, but it's hard to locate. Vromfogle had it at one time, and I think the matthatt site did too.
Is it this https://i.imgur.com/cZoGlO4.jpg one?
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Offline Siltoneous

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2020, 04:09:36 PM »
There is a 'NE Emer' image floating around, but it's hard to locate. Vromfogle had it at one time, and I think the matthatt site did too.
Is it this https://i.imgur.com/cZoGlO4.jpg one?
Nope. Here's a cut-down, smaller (and less clear) version of the one floating around out there.  https://imgur.com/CoAtwps  As I said, I found it while deep diving through various Internet Archive snapshots.
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Offline Crivens

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2020, 04:42:11 PM »
Thanks guys for your answers.
I manage all the maps using QGIS:
- I have the big Kulthea Western as a georeferenced basemap
- I have georeferenced all the maps I was able to find (Emer, Jaiman)
Doing this I am able to switch between those maps to digitilize everything I need (the cities, the realms, the roads, the rivers, the coral roads, etc.).

It take quite a lot of time to digest and digitize all these informations but when this job will be finished it will save me a lot of time.

Yes, I am a lazy man, able to spend to lot of time in the present in the hope I will save time in the future.
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Offline RandalThor

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2020, 05:02:44 PM »
Nope. Here's a cut-down, smaller (and less clear) version of the one floating around out there.  https://imgur.com/CoAtwps  As I said, I found it while deep diving through various Internet Archive snapshots.
I know the one you are talking about and swear I had it at one time. Probably 2 computer crashes ago.
Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Scratch that. Power attracts the corruptible.

Rules should not replace the brain and thinking.

Online Hurin

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2020, 05:04:40 PM »

Nope. Here's a cut-down, smaller (and less clear) version of the one floating around out there.  https://imgur.com/CoAtwps  As I said, I found it while deep diving through various Internet Archive snapshots.


Siltoneous: that map you posted is the one that is in Emer I, though in the version of Emer I that I have, the maps are cut up, so that each page shows only a small section. So what you're looking for I think is a full map of Emer, stitched together from the smaller maps that are in the final pages of Emer I?
'Last of all, Húrin stood alone. Then he cast aside his shield, and wielded an axe two-handed'. --J.R.R. Tolkien

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Offline Siltoneous

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2020, 04:18:08 PM »
Siltoneous: that map you posted is the one that is in Emer I, though in the version of Emer I that I have, the maps are cut up, so that each page shows only a small section.
Hurin, you're messing with me right? =)  I just opened my 'Emer I - Haestra' (Stock #6110) and I don't have that map in there. I would be surprised if it was, given that 'Emer I' is concerned with the NW of the Emer'ian continent (Haestra).  Whereas the image I posted shows the NE of the continent (Eidolon/Sel-Kai, Nuyan Khôm, Namar-Tol).  Now, my copy is second hand (AbeBooks) so perhaps it is missing something.

Now on the other hand, my physical copy of 'Emer II - The NorthEast' (Stock #6120) (a recent auction) does appears to have the map referenced above, just (as you say) split into 6 different images.

The noteworthy thing about that 'NE Emer2.png' floating around out there is that it's a single image of all 6 different maps.  I've looked close (no shame in stating I used a magnifying glass) and they are spot on.  No idea where that image came from, but it's a clean one @ 24bit. It does have labels on it, with site names also.

Quote
So what you're looking for I think is a full map of Emer, stitched together from the smaller maps that are in the final pages of Emer I?
Nope.  On my wish list is one one master map of the entire Emer'ian Continent but with the same level of detail we see in the 'Emer II' or 'Emer I' maps.  I'm talking all the major continental features; rivers, mountains, coastlines, etc.  Sure it'd have to be missing some things (ruins, unexplored areas, etc...) but I'm not so concerned about those. If it had a reference for the height elevation lines shown, even better (those elevation lines on those 'Emer I/II' maps were there for some reason).

Now Emer III's map, especially the one on pg 4, is some sweet stuff. Love the detailed legend , but it leaves me cold when compared to those Emer I/II maps.

I tell ya why I'd love to see it. I was working on a story line set in Nuyan-Khôm.  I couldn't figure out where in the nine-hells the White and Turquoise clans could exist (East of the Ash Mountains, and North of the Sharksteeth). The big 'standard' green/brown Emer maps you see at the end of the books (Emer I,II,III) just doesn't show enough detail.  However, after I got the 'Emer II' maps and saw the fine detail there, I could immediately see where those clans could exist. Which led me to throw out my starting campaign as it  no longer made sense (to me) to start there with my new knowledge.  No major issue there, as the rework has it starting in the White clan area, who use 'Boar' style goats (but more muscular, thicker) for things where they would have (in the past) used Horses.

But I ramble...

Maybe we can beg Terry to release one with his in progress 'Emer SW' product. Say 24kx24k @ 24bit.  I wouldn't care if it cost extra. =)

Silt

P.S. There does exist a single, LARGE image of NW Emer (Haestra). It's 9084 x 11359 @ 1bit depth (it is B/W after all).  I won't say where, but it is included in a product you can buy from ICE right now. I stumbled across it by complete accident a week or so ago.

Silt
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Online Hurin

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Re: Informations on Namar-tol and Nuyan Khom
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2020, 04:31:42 PM »
Yes, you're right Siltoneous; I meant Emer II (Northeast). It does seem like the maps in Emer I and II were cut down from a larger map of the whole continent with great detail. It would sure be great to see if that does exist somewhere!
'Last of all, Húrin stood alone. Then he cast aside his shield, and wielded an axe two-handed'. --J.R.R. Tolkien

'Every party needs at least one insane person.'  --Aspen of the Jade Isle