Topic: Using Creatures & Monsters with RMC

[vroomfogle]

I just wanted to make this post to encourage RMC folks out there to pick up the RMSS book Creatures & Monsters.    The book Creatures & Monsters is one of the finest improvements that RMSS made to the game.    It is basically C&T I, II, and III all rolled up into one (minus the "Treasures" portion).   The way it is laid out is very nice and I find that how each creature description also includes all the creature stats at the top is a great improvement over having to flip between the creature description and the big creature table for each section (as it is in C&T).

Now here's the interesting part....as near as I can tell there's no difference between the monster stats between C&M and C&T.   There *may* be some here and there, maybe more so with the races, but I doubt it.   Check the OB of any creature - they are identical between RMC and RMSS.  The idea of there being substantial incompatibilities between the systems is a myth.  RMSS changed the power balance between CHARACTERS from RM2 to RMSS, not for MONSTERS.   All the tables, stat blocks, etc..in C&M are all exactly the same as in C&T.

I think that most RMC users probably assume that C&M is not compatible with RMC.  This is unfortunate because C&M is the far better book with more info, more complete info, and better laid out info then C&T. 

So if you are an RMC fan and are hoping to get your hands on a C&T II or III...don't bother just buy Creatures & Monsters.

YMMV.

[pastaav]

If I recall correctly there was some minor changes to number of concussion hits on regular animals but none on the monsters...why they even bothered I never understood because you will be hard pressed to find a scenario when the small differences matter at all.

[ob1knorrb]

Are all the creatures from C&T III in the RMSS Creatures and Monsters book?  For some reason I thought it just had the creatures from C&T I and II.

[vroomfogle]

You may be right, I thought I had read that C&T III was in there.   But you'd be the one to know Brent!   I actually don't seem to have a copy of C&T III anymore.

pastaav, since Animals come first in RM2's C&T and RMSS C&M my suspicion is that they started to convert them to RMSS then said " $%#&*@ this !!, it doesn't matter enough! "

[ob1knorrb]

I'll have to dig mine out and check. I'm just going by memory of some older postings but I don't thing I've actually ever verified it.  I'll post my findings.

[ob1knorrb]

I took a quick look through my PDF's and I'm pretty sure that the Creatures in C&T III are not included in Creatures and Monsters, which is also supported by this statement on the first page of Creatures and Monsters:

COMPILATION NOTE: This product is a compilation as well a revision. Some of the material is the same as material published in Creatures & Treasures, Creatures & Treasures II, and various Rolemaster Companions. However, much of the game statistic information has been modified to align the entries with the Rolemaster Standard System.

[vroomfogle]

However, much of the game statistic information has been modified to align the entries with the Rolemaster Standard System.

Well at least this part of the quote isn't true.

I should snag the PDF of C&T III then.

[ob1knorrb]

It would be nice to have C&T III redone in the same style as the RMSS Creatures and Monsters.

[rdanhenry]

I have not noticed any monsters in C&M that I had never seen before and I do not have C&T III. In fact, C&M does not actually have all of the C&T I & II monsters, just most of them. (The only omission I've actually noticed is the "Entities from Deep Space" from C&T II, but I haven't done any kind of detailed comparison.) All of the creatures mentioned in the C&T III description on the ICE website are not in C&M.

The main changes are to C&T II monsters that had non-Spell-Law spell lists. These were removed/changed in C&M.

[giulio.trimarco]

Damn....

If I've read before...

I've bought all RMC line.

CC I don't like.
C&M and ARMS Low from RMSS is already in my library.

I neede only CL and SL from RMC?

[Erik Sharma]

I agree with Vroomfogle and would add Treasure Companion to that list. Find C&M and Treasure Companion a much better buy even for RMC players. I think the treasure system in TC is way better than the one in C&T. And with those 2 books you get everything and more of whats included in C&T.

As for the Power Points in C&M to bring them more in line with whats is in C&T I usually whould divide it by 2 to 4 to get it down to Core RMC values. Don't have the old C&Ts so I cannot compare if it's correct. But it is playable.

[Wōdwulf Seaxaning]

cool I own C&M . So I can either do w/o C&T or wait to get it later.

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

cool I own C&M . So I can either do w/o C&T or wait to get it later.

Yup, for the most part. What C&T does do is to better explain a number of monster abilities.

[dutch206]

I own C&T III.  Never used it.  Not once.

[giulio.trimarco]

C&M contains more beasts that can I will use in a lifetime...

well, now I have also C&T I'll use the one that I like more ... 

[Wōdwulf Seaxaning]

I'll post pone getting the RMC C&T till later as I have a limited buget. I'll pick up RMC character Law & Arms Law first, when I get to buying RMC.I'll probally get RMC Ex. first.