Topic: Question on Increased Armor Type

[whitedalek]

I have a question on increased armor type for magic armor that arose during my last game session. The question raised that if AT:13 was enchanted up to AT:15 (from chain shirt to longer chain shirt/greaves), what about crits that are negated by leg or arm armor? AT:13 has no such protection but AT:15 does. My initial thought is no. The benefit from increased armor type is shown in taking less damage and a less severe crit, but the physical aspects of the armor remain. One of my players is debating that it would protect them in such a crit due to the magical nature of the armor. This isn't a full-blown argument or anything, but rather a question of mechanics. Any thoughts?

[jdale]

It's definitely a judgment call, but personally I would say yes.

Also, if I was the GM, I would not have items of this type. Because the combat tables actually increase the chance of taking concussion hits with the higher AT, which doesn't really make sense. I would be more inclined to grant DB, critical reduction, reduced weight and MMP, or benefit of virtual armor for purposes of criticals (exactly this situation), but not increase the AT.

[markc]

Whitedalek,
 I would say no as you can add grieves to the AT 13 protects as AT 15 to get the protection of wearing arm and leg grieves. Now you could have armor that said protects as AT 15 and you are treated as wearing arm and leg grieves for critical purposes.


MDC   

[yammahoper]

I would say yes.  It is magic. 

[arakish]

Look at the attached image (but wait for approval).

That tiara she is wearing protects her head and neck as if it were a full helm.

As yammahoper said:

I would say yes.  It is magic. 

rmfr

[intothatdarkness]

It's definitely a judgment call, but personally I would say yes.

Also, if I was the GM, I would not have items of this type. Because the combat tables actually increase the chance of taking concussion hits with the higher AT, which doesn't really make sense. I would be more inclined to grant DB, critical reduction, reduced weight and MMP, or benefit of virtual armor for purposes of criticals (exactly this situation), but not increase the AT.

I also wouldn't have an item of this type. I might jump a chain shirt to a breastplate AT (same areas of protection), though. Again, it's a question of your game setting's norms. I might allow a tiara similar to what arakish describes, but it would have some offsetting negative to it (maybe it glows when worn, making Stalk/Hide very difficult, or it can only be active for a set amount of time per day).

[jdale]

I might allow a tiara similar to what arakish describes, but it would have some offsetting negative to it (maybe it glows when worn, making Stalk/Hide very difficult, or it can only be active for a set amount of time per day).

Funny you say that. A character in our game has a circlet that is basically the same (counts as a helmet, actually is critical reduction by one level if the critical targets the head). It did in fact glow in certain magical defenses, and also it's cursed. We've had it for years and still do not know what the curse is....

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

We've had it for years and still do not know what the curse is....

Making you so obsessed about what the curse is that you have headaches!

[markc]

  If you also look at some of the Arms Law spell lists there are spells that provide the caster with magical helm and bracers. That is the spell allows for the crit to be adjusted as if you were wearing said item.


 In my game I have used the circlet (as helm), AT 13 to AT 14, AT 13 to AT 17, as well as many others and it worked fine. But my game at the time was not really a low powered game in that the PC's tended to find stuff much more powerful than could be created at the time.


MDC

[intothatdarkness]

My games tend to stray more toward gritty and low-powered. Most of the powerful magic items characters find do have downsides to them.

[arakish]

In my game I have used the circlet (as helm), AT 13 to AT 14, AT 13 to AT 17, as well as many others and it worked fine. But my game at the time was not really a low powered game in that the PC's tended to find stuff much more powerful than could be created at the time.

My games tend to stray more toward gritty and low-powered. Most of the powerful magic items characters find do have downsides to them.

My games tend to follow along the same routes.  But, I should have mentioned that the tiara Sara wears was actually manufactured for her great great grandmother many hundreds of years in the past and has been handed down through the years.  It was with Sara's grandmother being killed, but a companion returned the tiara to her family, given to Sara's mother, and the knowledge that the tiara is magical was lost.  Sara only wears it as an heirloom and still has yet to discover its magical properties.  She only thinks her combat dodging capabilities and her own Power usage is what saves her from many blows that should have killed her.

However, whenever Sara is near a ManaNode, the jewel in the tiara begins to glow brighter the closer she is to the Node; thus, that could spoil her Stalking and Hiding.  She has noticed the jewel does glow at times, but still does not know what it means.

Thus, in a way, due to the massive amounts of Lore lost over 1300 years ago, you can say such things do have a kind of downside.  Sometmes horrible, sometimes with no consequence.

Sorry for the ranting.  But as many have said, and I do agree with, it is all dependent upon how the GM defines how magic/power works on their world.

rmfr

[whitedalek]

I just want to thank everyone for their suggestions. I've decided to allow the armor to protect in the crit tables just as it was physically the higher armor type. After all, it is magic armor.