Topic: How do mages survive?

[David Johansen]

By making sure the fighter isn't in the fireball's area effect.

[Marc R]

I agree with the put someone between you and the combat logic, magic items help, if they exist, but at low levels it's often best to keep out of range of a fight. . .the various movement lists tend to be one of my first picks for a mage. . . ."run away" is a good ploy. . . .as is sticking to roleplay. . . I can think of many low level mages who flat out refused to go out into the wilds courting danger. . . .you're a high status professional, like a newly graduated doctor, why are you out in the woods hunting orcs if you don't have 3-4 beefy types around to protect you?

[Skarsgard]

One thing that I feel I should mention.

Roleplaying is generally as part of a group. People should be able to play whatever class they like and the GM should try to accomodate them. However, you can't really play a game when one player is "running away" or claiming the "high status professional" line.

If I was playing in a game and the mage (1/3 of the party in my case) decided to flee something that the rest of us could not (a lot of things are faster than PC's), then I would be more than slightly annoyed since they have just reduced the chances of the other characters surviving.

Roleplaying is a group game, everyone wants to contribute and have fun, being left in the lurch time and time again is frustrating. People should design character responsibly, not from a "it's all about me" point of view.

[kevinmccollum]

professional, like a newly graduated doctor, why are you out in the woods hunting orcs if you don't have 3-4 beefy types around to protect you?

Like in residency? Where they work ungodly hours? Our newly appointed low level mage has to put his time in too, to prove himself and hone his skills. Ergo, adventuring with 3-4 beefy types.

[Witchking20k]

I've never had great success in getting mage types to live through early levels in RM.  However, full parry is great, and don't forget the Hail Mary +0 attack!  Protect yourself and swing wildly at the attacker (hoping for an openended roll).

[yammahoper]

I would argue a new doctor is not level one, but probably level 3 (minimum) to level 8 (maximum).  They are also closer to 30 years old than not.

No mage would hit the street at level one unless he had to.   Of course, I am totally over the level system and would like it to go away in the next version of RM, just to state my bias.  However, I think we often get stuck on having to start at level one because "that's what you do."  I disagree and I do not think it is realistic.

[Marc R]

depends on where you start off. . . .if it's in the field killing monsters, level 1 seems unlikely for a mage, if you start off in your third term at Hogwarts, then perhaps it makes more sense.

[yammahoper]

depends on where you start off. . . .if it's in the field killing monsters, level 1 seems unlikely for a mage, if you start off in your third term at Hogwarts, then perhaps it makes more sense.

Certainly, everything is relative.

For us, starting a level one game is the exception.  Unless the sorty calls for it, we do not.  We grew out of having to.  Starting with a level 6 PC is not cheating or evil.  Doing so makes much more sense when I'm playing an ex marine turned cop who has been on the force for almost two years.

What I do not like about the typical 1st level PC is how they seem to live in a vacuum and limit the story that can be wrapped around them.  My freinds and I play for fun, and after 25+ years of gaming, level one has lost most of its allure.

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

depends on where you start off. . . .if it's in the field killing monsters, level 1 seems unlikely for a mage, if you start off in your third term at Hogwarts, then perhaps it makes more sense.

I'm sure that in a game where "you start off in your third term at Hogwarts", you'd be killing monsters in the field anyway, so it's pretty much the same!

It's weird to have at the same time a thread where someone complains about mages being too powerful, and a thread where someone wonders how mages can survive being so vulnerable.

[Right Wing Wacko]

It's weird to have at the same time a thread where someone complains about mages being too powerful, and a thread where someone wonders how mages can survive being so vulnerable.

And that alone should serve as evidence that this is all subjective and depends on a multitude of variables that cannot be readily defined.

[Pyske]

It's weird to have at the same time a thread where someone complains about mages being too powerful, and a thread where someone wonders how mages can survive being so vulnerable.

Just bear in mind, I didn't doubt that they can survive; I was just failing to see how to make it happen.  I started with the assumption that the failure was mine, not the system's.

I assume when we talk about running away, y'all mean "get out of melee range / behind cover", as opposed to "flee the scene entirely".

Similarly, I'm entertained by the (apparently ongoing) argument about 1st level characters, since that wasn't really part of the original premise.

[providence13]

I think that duality is the important thing here!

Mages are too powerful....eventually.

How do Mages survive.....low levels; like 1st!!

Since two topics are going on about this issue, I think that it's an important one!

I don't have alot, ok many, none really, answers... but it does seem revenant.

Sorry, relevant to the game. 

[kevinmccollum]

I must be confused. Is this mage who can't survive first level going out solo? I don't think survival of a GROUP has ever been a problem. any solo character in a fantasy RPG is going to die horribly. If this mage is in a group, simply because he is weak makes it easier to survive as any semi-sentient creature is going to take out the bigger threats first and our little robed weakling isn't the big threat.

[Right Wing Wacko]

I must be confused. Is this mage who can't survive first level going out solo? I don't think survival of a GROUP has ever been a problem. any solo character in a fantasy RPG is going to die horribly. If this mage is in a group, simply because he is weak makes it easier to survive as any semi-sentient creature is going to take out the bigger threats first and our little robed weakling isn't the big threat.

Exactly!
And a very smart creature would take out the mage first!
 

[kevinmccollum]

Really? He has a choice of a guy who may or may not be able to cast a devestating spell or a guy wearing a lot of metal and some nasty weapons. Until that robed guy running around screaming like a little girl actually DOES something, why worry about him? And once that hard, crunchy protective coating (the assorted melee types) go down, we all know how soft and juicy the remaining casters are........

[Right Wing Wacko]

Really? He has a choice of a guy who may or may not be able to cast a devestating spell or a guy wearing a lot of metal and some nasty weapons. Until that robed guy running around screaming like a little girl actually DOES something, why worry about him? And once that hard, crunchy protective coating (the assorted melee types) go down, we all know how soft and juicy the remaining casters are........

Yep!
Really.

IMHO of course.
Leaving the Mage unmolested will make the Fighter-types harder to beat.

[Ecthelion]

Really? He has a choice of a guy who may or may not be able to cast a devestating spell or a guy wearing a lot of metal and some nasty weapons. Until that robed guy running around screaming like a little girl actually DOES something, why worry about him? And once that hard, crunchy protective coating (the assorted melee types) go down, we all know how soft and juicy the remaining casters are........

The disagreement IMO shows that there does not to be a common knowledge whom to attack first. Therefore in our group we always let the dice decide who gets attacked. Everything else is biased by the GM knowledge - which does not have to be the monster's knowledge.

YMMV

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

The disagreement IMO shows that there does not to be a common knowledge whom to attack first.

The healer, or the leader.

[markc]

BTW making a PSI-Doctor in SM:P with the various TP's my player took 6 levels to become a doctor.
MDC

[Arioch]

Exactly!
And a very smart creature would take out the mage first!
 

Because everyone knows that magic users are too powerful! 

Just joking, I couldn't resist!

I assume when we talk about running away, y'all mean "get out of melee range / behind cover", as opposed to "flee the scene entirely".

Yes!