Topic: So..

[Nightblade42]

On the plus side (for me at least), I can go back to Nytheun.  Perhaps my Beisash Way Station might fit the bill for a Starter Pack.  We're still talking D&D/LotResque fantasy, tho.  But it's something.

Nightblade ->--

[Witchking20k]

I think bows/crossbows can easily be used as the guidelines for firearms.  RMX used a Rapid Load & Fire Penalty.  This could just be renames Recoil and serve as a penalty for firing in rapid succession.  Reload times could be based on a Sling for something like a bolt action rifle.  I think one of the tricks about firearms is to not write a whole set of rules exclusive to them.

[jdale]

A lot of the complexity of firearms comes from high rates of fire relative to the duration of the combat round. If you pick a setting that limits them to black powder, those issues go away and you really just need an attack table (possibly only one plus size modifiers and range modifiers), maybe also a critical chart.

[intothatdarkness]

A lot of the complexity of firearms comes from high rates of fire relative to the duration of the combat round. If you pick a setting that limits them to black powder, those issues go away and you really just need an attack table (possibly only one plus size modifiers and range modifiers), maybe also a critical chart.

I've got both. And no, bows and crossbows don't work for firearms. My stuff for firearms is composed of attack tables, a set of modifiers for to-hit based on recoil and range, and that's pretty much it. Frankly, RM got firearms wrong most of the time when they tried to do them....in part because the old round was simply too long and also in part because too many of the sourcebooks treated them like crossbows or bows. Once you crack the code regarding maximum damage based on caliber and bullet weight, the rest is fairly easy and quick to resolve.

[Peter R]

It is funny how people instinctively go for bows and crossbows.

If I had no table to hand I used the sling table. They at least fired bullets!

[Peter R]

Pulp era survival after a plane crash in northern Ontario.

You could make it like a post-nuclear holocaust survival game just by setting it in Sudbury.

You can do either of these, just don't have guns on the plane or available.

[Peter R]

Fair point re: gun rules, Peter.  Some of the other ideas might fair better (& here I just was re-reading the manuscript to that Pseudo-Pulp story I started a while back).

I guess that means Cyberspace & Space Operas are out until those kinds of weapons rules are developed (probably with SMU - if & when that happens).

Back to ancient greece & egypt then (& similar settings), I guess 

Nightblade ->--

Do not let the lack of guns limit your imagination.

I am from the UK so my world view is somewhat skewed but...

• The Iceni/Roman/Boudica period could be a great setting check out https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5932548/?ref_=nv_sr_1 and the episode guide for plot ideas. No one can copyright "Britannia" as a name.
• William Wallace, think Braveheart
• The Dane Law period was serialised from the Bernard Cornwall novels recently as The Last Kingdom. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4179452/?ref_=nv_sr_1 again see the episode list for plot ideas
• Stepping away from the historical we get Atlantis https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2705602/?ref_=nv_sr_3
• Tudors anyone? The war of the roses was the inspiration for Game of Thrones. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0758790/
• Shakespeare anyone? RPGs set in the backdrop of the historical plays. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2262456/episodes?season=1&ref_=ttep_ep_sn_pv

Those are ideas which are basically tie-ins to BBC tv series. There is no need use anything from the series but it is a lot faster to what an episode and take notes and be inspired than it is to wade through play after play or countless history texts looking for inspiration.

Now lets go off piste...

• There are no guns in Scooby Doo so an investigative RPG is ruled in. You could just as easily read that as Nancy Drew or the Hardy Boys. Personally I wouldn't want to play it but it would certainly reach an non-traditional Rolemaster audience!
• The Titanic. Imagine a plot where the titanic was sunk by an Anarchists bomb. You could have a gun on board but in a set play the anarchist fires the gun at the characters a couple of times to effect his or her escape and on the third shot it jams irrevocably.
• The entire Kung Fu genre is pretty much gun free.
• There are some classic films that are pretty much gun free, Blair Witch Project, the norwegian film Troll Hunter. We have trolls as a playable race in A&CL.
• A modern day RPG set about the idea of mad cultists. If you set it in the UK guns are simply not common. Also most of the people seduced into joining the cult could well be completely innocent, it is only the priesthood that are likely to be murderous psychopaths with ceremonial daggers.
• A bermuda triangle rpg. The players are on a yacht that is blown off course during a tropical storm. In the morning clear sky reveals a traditional tall ship drifting nearby. No crew seem to be onboard. Are the players back in the 1700s or is there a ship from the eighteenth century suddenly drifting off the florida keys?

That is pretty much 15 minutes worth of ideas.

If I were French/German/Scandinavian then I am guessing my inspirations would be completely different. I haven't even touched on the Crusades/Knights Templar/The inquisition/Viking sagas or alternative histories.

[Peter R]

I just thought of a paranormal investigation game. You let the characters have guns but you don't need rules or attack tables as nothing is harmed by them, as in you cannot shoot a ghost or poltergeist. Firing the gun simply becomes a narrative device as the GM describes pot plants exploding or mirrors shattering. The players still make open ended attack rolls and can buy the skill but you just don't need attack tables as they do no damage.

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

(...)

• The entire Kung Fu genre is pretty much gun free.

How well a wuxia module works depends a lot on how much one can do with the martial arts rules, though it doesn't need to be that complex --just enough to tie with for the cinematic aspects. Once that is done, the rest isn't really hard, since no actual historical background is necessary, just enough to get the general fantasy feeling of wuxia. The more problematic aspect may come from the lack of weapon tables for eastern weapons though.

...that being said, I'm able to do that with RM2 so, if we're allowed to also provide custom weapon tables, I guess it's feasible in RMU.

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

I just thought of a paranormal investigation game. You let the characters have guns but you don't need rules or attack tables as nothing is harmed by them, as in you cannot shoot a ghost or poltergeist. Firing the gun simply becomes a narrative device as the GM describes pot plants exploding or mirrors shattering. The players still make open ended attack rolls and can buy the skill but you just don't need attack tables as they do no damage.

Make it a Cthulhu story. Your weapons would be pretty much useless. 

[Peter R]

(...)

• The entire Kung Fu genre is pretty much gun free.

How well a wuxia module works depends a lot on how much one can do with the martial arts rules, though it doesn't need to be that complex --just enough to tie with for the cinematic aspects. Once that is done, the rest isn't really hard, since no actual historical background is necessary, just enough to get the general fantasy feeling of wuxia. The more problematic aspect may come from the lack of weapon tables for eastern weapons though.

I am glad you are here OLF. I put the French reference in my post above explicitly to attract your attention.

I am imagining that the attack tables in these one off games will not look like the attack tables that RM traditionalists will be used to. If I were to write up an Enter The Dragon style game there is absolutely no need for different armour types as no one has any armour, there are no size rules as everyone is human. Attack size applies because of charging and maybe small or two handed weapons. So if attack tables are just a single row then you could have a dozen on a page. Creating new rows for specific weapons is not a massive task, surely? Additionally if we get it not quite right, does it matter? *IF* the game suddenly became popular then tweaking the damage up or down a point here to there in a companion would not break the game.

[Peter R]

I just thought of a paranormal investigation game. You let the characters have guns but you don't need rules or attack tables as nothing is harmed by them, as in you cannot shoot a ghost or poltergeist. Firing the gun simply becomes a narrative device as the GM describes pot plants exploding or mirrors shattering. The players still make open ended attack rolls and can buy the skill but you just don't need attack tables as they do no damage.

Make it a Cthulhu story. Your weapons would be pretty much useless. 

I was trying to avoid the cliché of Cthulhu and besides Darkspace kind of does that already. I am also producing lots of Cthulhu inspired adventures at the moment but yes, that is what I was getting at.

[rdanhenry]

I just thought of a paranormal investigation game. You let the characters have guns but you don't need rules or attack tables as nothing is harmed by them, as in you cannot shoot a ghost or poltergeist. Firing the gun simply becomes a narrative device as the GM describes pot plants exploding or mirrors shattering. The players still make open ended attack rolls and can buy the skill but you just don't need attack tables as they do no damage.

Until they start shooting at each other or some human NPC that wasn't intended to be a target. That won't happen in every group, but it will happen in some groups.

[Peter R]

I just thought of a paranormal investigation game. You let the characters have guns but you don't need rules or attack tables as nothing is harmed by them, as in you cannot shoot a ghost or poltergeist. Firing the gun simply becomes a narrative device as the GM describes pot plants exploding or mirrors shattering. The players still make open ended attack rolls and can buy the skill but you just don't need attack tables as they do no damage.

Until they start shooting at each other or some human NPC that wasn't intended to be a target. That won't happen in every group, but it will happen in some groups.

But you still don't need detailed combat rules for guns. If your group shoots at an innocent you kill the innocent. The GM runs the world and sets the tone of the game.

[Witchking20k]

One thing about guns - is they necessitate healing.  It's not fantasy roleplaying where healers, herbs, and potions abound.......someone shot will likely die, sooner or later, without healing.  And even with healing the recovery time would not be very game friendly.

[Nightblade42]

Speaking of the British Isles, Peter.  How 'bout something with a little bit more Celtic flair - you could do dark age pre-Saxon Brittain with Druids, Bards, the Fæ (Tuatha de Danaan) & even Celtic heroes like Cú Chulainn or Fionn mac Cumhaill.

I guess my Pseudo-Pulp setting could work - though one of the main players in the story thusfar is a Weapons manufacturing company that is one of the biggest backers of the Nazi-like regime that rules the country where the story begins.  It would still be nice to have some sort of firearms rules, beyond what is offered in SM; Cyberspace & Weapon Law.  But those are a start, I guess.

Still, I seem to have gotten stuck in the Beisash Way Station at the moment.  A nice little spot that I'm only starting to explore.

Nightblade ->--

[Peter R]

One thing about guns - is they necessitate healing.  It's not fantasy roleplaying where healers, herbs, and potions abound.......someone shot will likely die, sooner or later, without healing.  And even with healing the recovery time would not be very game friendly.

I would certainly include healing rules as standard. The way you portray healing can set the tone of the entire game. If heroes are fully healed at the end of every scene then that invites a hack and slash approach to everything. If you heroes spend weeks and months in hospital that says something else.

If you don't want the players using guns then operate a 'Bang! You're dead!' system.

My NaGaDeMon game this year has about 25 words about guns, single shot, double tap, 3 round bursts and fully automatic fire but it has several paragraphs plus examples about healing and death. The emphasis is on not fighting, not getting hurt and not killing innocent people. In another twist the demonic creatures are immune to bullets anyway so should a player spray a room with bullets then only innocent people will get hurt.

[Peter R]

Speaking of the British Isles, Peter.  How 'bout something with a little bit more Celtic flair - you could do dark age pre-Saxon Brittain with Druids, Bards, the Fæ (Tuatha de Danaan) & even Celtic heroes like Cú Chulainn or Fionn mac Cumhaill.

I guess my Pseudo-Pulp setting could work - though one of the main players in the story thusfar is a Weapons manufacturing company that is one of the biggest backers of the Nazi-like regime that rules the country where the story begins.  It would still be nice to have some sort of firearms rules, beyond what is offered in SM; Cyberspace & Weapon Law.  But those are a start, I guess.

Still, I seem to have gotten stuck in the Beisash Way Station at the moment.  A nice little spot that I'm only starting to explore.

Nightblade ->--

Too many possibilities, too little time.

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

I am glad you are here OLF. I put the French reference in my post above explicitly to attract your attention.

We could write a story set during the Hundred Years' War. You write the English side whilst I write the French side, so that a GM may play as one side or the other.

[Peter R]

I am glad you are here OLF. I put the French reference in my post above explicitly to attract your attention.

We could write a story set during the Hundred Years' War. You write the English side whilst I write the French side, so that a GM may play as one side or the other.

I like that idea, it would be a crazy looking game with two distinctly different voices. The only real consideration is that I am a terrible writer. If you want to have a go then PM me and we can talk it over.