Author Topic: New Spacemaster Imperium modules  (Read 5277 times)

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Offline Terry K. Amthor

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New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« on: May 24, 2014, 08:48:39 AM »
So, Second Edition 'Imperium' Spacemaster (maybe we need a new name for it, because it is going to be HARP as well as Rolemaster; thoughts?) had GM Book, Player Book, and Tech Book. How would you like to see the new version organized?

I personally would like to do a basic GM book with history and a survey of all the major houses and organizations, then maybe individual books about each greater house and its lesser subsidiaries (the latter similar to the old version, with updates). Ne books would include the Dia Khovaria (all about their databases, TBD tech and recovered alien tech), and one about the Imperial family.

A new Tech book would remain basically a SPAM 'Arms Law.'

A new Imperium Vehicles and Stations book would include more spacecraft, space stations, etc. and more details about getting around in the empire.

These are just my ideas, nothing even close to binding. Discuss!
Terry K. Amthor
Shadow World Author, Rolemaster & SpaceMaster Co-Designer, ICE co-founder.
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"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
-- Clarke's First Law.

Offline Wolfhound

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2014, 10:28:09 AM »
That sounds like a good staring point or structure to me.  Personally I'd also like to see (and this has been mentioned by others in regards to HARP-SF already) a book that details equipment and how to design your own ships and vehicles (similar to the Armored Assault and Star Strike products).  With it intended for the Imperium setting, but also with details of different technology levels for less advanced settings for GM's who have their own settings as well as for the current HARP Tintamar setting, for adjusting to different technology levels.

On that note however it might be worth organzing those details at least prior to writing the Vehicles and Stations book that you mentioned, just so that they are consistant with such rules.
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Offline Terry K. Amthor

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2014, 12:37:33 PM »
At the Dia Khovaria headquarters...

Monsignor Rogelio Cena was obviously unhappy with the Cardinal’s choice of walking speed, but of course there was little he could do about it. No doubt this stalling is yet another of his petty mind games, always trying to keep me off-guard. He absently wiped his large, red nose with a truecotton kerchief.

Despite the latest Interferex treatments, Rogelio invariably developed sinus problems when in the vicinity of blooming flowers. The Curia Headquarters of the Tabernacle on Hanaan IV, with their many courtyards full of gardens, especially aggravated his nasal passages. And it was spring, no less! Yet another trick by Dederu, I’ll wager. Cena angrily stuffed his kerchief up a sleeve of his (relatively) plain vestments. Even their flowing lengths did not conceal his portly frame.

“Things are moving very quickly now, Rogelio.” The Cardinal spoke the way he walked, his baritone voice pronouncing every word with deliberate, infinite care. “His Holiness has advised me that there are substantiated reports of a fabulous archaeological find on one of the planets in the Thessel system.”

“Indeed, Your Eminence?” Rogelio did not know whether or not to be pleased. If there were Old Ones artifacts, and the Holy Tabernacle could gain possession of them, the Church’s power base would be that much stronger. The reputation of the Dia Khovaria, especially in the esteem of the Emperor, was not what it once was, and control of powerful Althan artifacts could very quickly reaffirm their authority.

On the other hand, Rogelio knew that the Cardinal did not call him halfway across the Empire to the Khovaria headquarters on Hanaan just to tell him this information. No doubt there was some odious task involved that ‘only dear, loyal Rogelio’ could perform. Poor Rogelio! The Monsignor retrieved his kerchief just in time to contain a thunderous sneeze.

“Yes, my son. If I understand the communication correctly, the Emperor’s Archaeological Institute has already dispatched a ship to perform a general survey. The Institute team is apparently using Imara as headquarters for their expeditions.”

“Imara? That is the Carlisle capital planet, is it not?”

“True, my son. Family Carlisle rules Imara — and Thessel falls within their jurisdiction as well.”

“I have heard that Duke Toren Carlisle is a very ambitious man, Your Eminence. Surely he will not easily surrender the Artifacts once he gets his hands of them.”

“True, my good Rogelio.  We certainly cannot depend on the tenuous power of our esteemed Emperor to keep Lord Toren honest. Even though all such artifacts are technically the property of His Highness, Carlisle would try to find a way to claim them. There is added complication as well.”
Terry K. Amthor
Shadow World Author, Rolemaster & SpaceMaster Co-Designer, ICE co-founder.
Eidolon Studio Art Director


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
-- Clarke's First Law.

Offline VladD

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2014, 03:13:58 PM »
I am thrilled to see a unified Space Master setting. Also rewriting some of the tech details should be exiting.

I would like to suggest that there will be a jump in power from the fantasy to the modern to the futuristic, so that there is a realistic progression. Also all the 80's tech should be revised to make it better than the stuff we have nowadays, especially in computing power.

As for the Terran Empire: empires were usually named after the place they originated from, or the country that built them. Terra or Sol Empire seems most appropriate. The old houses were one of fun factors in the imperium setting. The old campaign modules added a lot of depth. The tailored adventures made a lot of sense.

I personally liked the spaceships a lot. The art was quite original and I liked how the ships were designed along a certain realistic philosophy. I would like to see a slightly less confusing classification system: SMAC, TMAC and MMAC or whatever did not do it for me. I would like to see something else besides the earth shipping classifications though...

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Offline Wolfhound

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2014, 07:48:35 AM »
I agree with VladD.  The political intrigue potential was fantastic within the imperial setting, with the different houses and other organizations vying for power, as can be seen by Terry's sample plot-hook above.  But the technology stuff should definitely be updated, especially with the technological advances we have seen since the 80's when most of that material was orginally written and then theorized out to what might be by the time the setting takes place (the concept of a 3D printer useable with a wide-range of products could replace or greatly change a large ship's machine shop for maintenance needs, powerful computer servers that can be carried in your pocket or worn on your wrist or in the frame of your glasses, etc.). 

On that note, I also like the idea of having more than one type of long-distance option for travel.  Maybe use a combination of both the gate system from HARP-SF and the RIF system that was previously used for the Imperium setting, with advantages and disadvantages for each.  I also agree that the ships for the Imperium setting were very good in comparison to most other Sci-Fi RPG's in my opinion.
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Offline Guillaume

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2014, 12:17:45 AM »
For me the split should be :

Player Book ( with character generation and all the system stuff )
Tech Book ( with all the tech thingies and the combat tables )
Universe Book ( with all the background )

If you need some ships/space stations for the Vehicle and Ships I might have some lying around.

And I need to catch up on the OCR recovery thread... Vacations are bad for following forums.
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Offline TerryTee

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2014, 08:42:37 AM »
SM2 is the only ICE game I play on a regular basis. I’m both a GM and a player, and my group tend to use the setting provided, or at least use it as a base for a setting. I’d love to see SM2 revamped somehow.

Here are some random thoughts about organization and content.

Is it necessarily so that Arms Law = Tech Book? To me, combat rules and combat tables belong together. But I suppose Player stuff (combat rules) do not belong with GM stuff (attack tables). So this is an issue that must be handled, and probably for other areas as well.
I guess it is important to create clear boundaries, and then divide content according to those boundaries in different books. The trick is to find new and better ways of doing it. There are probably several dimensions to consider: Players/GM, Rules/Setting, ‘Large rule sections’/Quick reference,. Is Technology also Setting? Can Rules exist without Setting? This is turning into philosophy (but the questions are not new, they have been raised before). Anyway, the boundaries in the SM2 book are not clear, that much is clear.

I only play SM2, but I still own several of the Priveteer books. I have only browsed them on occasion but it did seem like there is a nice approach to tech levels there. This may be an approach.

A good cybernetics system is needed. Personally I prefer the one in Cyberspace over the one in SM Companion II. The latter one did have a few cool things (like tech level, all though it was called mark), it just seemed unfinished and could probably have been quite good.

I don’t know what is best: Does it even work with a generic Players book with rules and no Setting? So many things about characters are connected to the Setting. Same thing with many of the rules. Perhaps the Players book might as well have lots of setting material in order to make it a better Players book for that setting.

Some possible books
  • Players book. With or without much setting material
  • Setting/universe book. Mainly for the GM
  • Arms Law. Weapons and Attack tables. Combat rules in players? Or only in Arms Law and not in Players?
  • Tech book. Non weaponry tech. Tech level system. Design your own tech system. Includes vehicles and ships.
  • AI. Droids, androids, robots, computers, cyber entities.
  • Creatures and Treasures. Same as RM, or similar to Aliens and Artifacts.
-Terry

Offline Turbs

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2014, 01:45:04 AM »
don't forget *cough* cybermaster *cough* supplement book to allow us to play out our near-future cybernetic dark urban firefights too!   ;D
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Offline broodhunter

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2015, 05:40:36 AM »
Does anyone have any idea where the Darkspace worlds lie in the spacemaster universe?

Offline egdcltd

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2015, 09:32:30 AM »
Does anyone have any idea where the Darkspace worlds lie in the spacemaster universe?

I'm pretty sure they are in their own universe. I would say the most likely way of travelling to them would be in the vicinity of Shadow World.
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Offline Alten

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2015, 12:50:49 PM »
As I remember, a scenario at the end linked it with Imperium space and House Zapotec-Yunnan. If you locate that, put Dark Space farther away on the frontier. I don't remember any precise placement.
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Offline egdcltd

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2015, 01:41:59 PM »
As I remember, a scenario at the end linked it with Imperium space and House Zapotec-Yunnan. If you locate that, put Dark Space farther away on the frontier. I don't remember any precise placement.

You're right, there's a paragraph at the end of the book, locating the Dark Nebula just outside of Xapotec-Yunnan space.
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Offline Hurin

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2015, 05:52:28 PM »
I liked the old GM Book, Player Book, Tech Book split myself.

I preferred SM Imperium over Privateers (but then again, I'm a RM2 kind of guy), but I did very much like some of the things privateers did. The races were good and gave more variability (than just Transhuman I, II, III, IV, etc.). I also liked the way Privateers handled tech levels, with different weapons having better stats and more killing power at higher tech levels.

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Offline Wōdwulf Seaxaning

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #13 on: April 07, 2017, 02:15:45 AM »
Setting Book
Tech Law
Character Law
Like Hurin I prefer SM2 & I also agree with him on how SM:P did do races better than SM2. I also agree with the others that the tech stuff needs a vast update & cybernetics needs to be rebooted in the vein of Cyberspace. The SMU game also should have an updated Cyberspace setting/rules supplement.
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Offline Wōdwulf Seaxaning

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #14 on: December 15, 2017, 01:10:03 AM »
Some new thoughts Terry A. I think the name of the setting should be Terra Imperium or Terra Empire & not Sol Imperium as it could cause IP issues with Traveller since their setting is called "the Imperium" & they've used it since 1977. Talking about Traveller, SM needs a solid & robust but easy to follow Space Station, robot & spaceship creation rules; as well as a race/alien & revised planet creation rules. Potentially updated space & vehicle combat rules, including those for mecha.

As I said i another thread I'd love for the setting to be system agnostic, with HARP-SF & a potential RMU crunch supplements tied to each line. I'd still prefer a SM2 updated setting & equipment books as I'll likely no longer by SMU or RMU. Don't fret I'll not be bashing either, but I'll only run SM2 & RM2/Classic/RMX or HARP/HARP-SF (plus Cyberspace) if I run any ICE games.
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Offline Jenkyna

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2018, 09:13:22 PM »
Since Traveller got mentioned I would add the following.

Traveller's Imperium was once described as a akin to a solar system with the fleets, the nobles, and the megacorporations all trapped in orbit around the Iridium Throne. A balance so delicate that if something were to destabilize it the whole thing would fly apart.

Outside of the Imperium you had external forces like the Zhodani Consulate, and The Aslan Hierate trying to pull it apart. When Rebellion occurred the Imperium flew apart, and then the external nations pounced on the remains.

Now in my opinion Spacemaster's Imperium should remain Spacemaster. I like the Imperium that ICE published, and Spacemaster games aren't really much like Traveller games. I only mention the above because I found that those internal and external forces at play made Traveller's setting very compelling. It was a perfect stage for high drama, and when you went from Rebellion to Virus to Collapse everything about it worked. It was very much like a living civilization. Of course it was Mark Miller's main focus for one heck of a long time, and to give credit where credit is due that shows.

I wouldn't want Spacemasters Imperium to try to be Travellers, but it should have the same potential for adventure as Traveller's. The forces at play should make sense.

My own current Imperium is at it's core the Spacemaster original with some Star Wars tossed in because my players liked it. The external nations are heavily drawn from Traveller with some Warhammer 40k elements tossed in. It's quite the mutt.  ;D

Offline MisterK

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Re: New Spacemaster Imperium modules
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2018, 04:03:54 AM »
What I liked in the old SM2 Imperium setting was that is was, at heart, a human social construct. Aliens were completely peripheral, especially before the companions. In this regard, it was quite similar to what Fading Suns would later be. The difference, of course, being that FS is a science-fantasy setting with a significant post-collapse flavour while SM:I is a pure sci-fi setting.

Blending in more alien races in a Star Wars-like fashion would IMO detract from the main appeal of the setting. Transhumans and Replicants are OK because they are fundamentally the twisted results of human ambitions. Technically speaking, they were perhaps *too* good at times (especially the House Kashmere transhumans), and the social stigma, emphasised for the replicants, was perhaps not explicit enough for the transhumans, but overall, it was a good background for compelling stories about human vices, ambitions and failures.

I concur with the previous posters who say that the tech would have to be updated... unless you want to pitch a retro-future feel, but it tends to clash with overall theme of SM:I (retro-future is often associated with pulp action, kind of rocket age science fiction).

Where I tend to diverge is on the visual aspects - SM:I graphics, especially for weapons and ships, did not do it for me - there was absolutely no relation between the technology used and the general look and feel of the ships - and the weapons graphics suffered from the same issue. My opinion is that tech and tech constraints should come first, and then the item/vehicle should be designed around those constraints, while keeping in mind the objectives (aesthetics ? performance ? payload capacity ?). For instance, if ships use reaction propulsion in normal space, large thrusters and linear frames will provide pure axial thrust performance but poor manoeuverability, while thrusters at the end of very elongated fins will provide better manoeuverability but poor resilience (with the fins being vulnerable). Same with weapons : conventional slugthrowers and railguns typically requires gun barrels (the longer the better for accuracy and longer ranges), but why would laser weapons follow the same logic ? Why would plasma weapons ? I would argue that plasma weapons could have a shorter barrel but a very bulky body because of magnetic coils required to shape and accelerate the plasma discharge (and possibly refrigerant systems as well), which would give them a very recognizable outlook. Couple that with manufacturer cultural/aesthetic bias (Warhammer 40K weapons are very good examples of that) and you can have something that is both part of the graphic signature of the game and visually useful during gameplay - and that's what I am looking for in graphical design.