Official ICE Forums
Systems & Settings => Rolemaster => Topic started by: Peter R on September 14, 2014, 04:50:12 AM
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I saw a comment yesterday, I forget which thread it was in, that said that most of the people here are GMs and not players. I have looked at my own activity and it seems true. I am really active right now because I am planning a new game. I joined the boards in 2012 when I was GMing and my game was just winding down. Between times my GM was the final arbiter or any disputes and his rules and rulings were what were important and the community less so. I am not one to argue against GMs ruling during the game even if they are simply wrong.
I am just curious if we are nearly exclusively GMs seeking inspiration and clarification because we are the creators. As players we then become more passive and are consumers of others creations.
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Only way for me to play RM or any other ICE game is to be GM :'(
I used to think that I'm mainly player but after 2000 I've played four session as player.
I do play in one D&D (3.5) game.
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We have a strange set up where our group live all over the south and south west UK and we all gather a couple of times a year to play but then play all weekend. We found that once you became GM then that was it, the end of your playing for the next five years or so. We are starting to look at playing one game on the Friday night and then the main campaign on the Saturday/Sunday. When the main games finishes then the Friday night game will become the main game and we will start new characters in a new game on the Fridays. This way everyone gets to game and the GMing is split between two people. We will be doing a Forgotten Realms based game with 1st level characters in the next session on the Friday night and a Shadow World game with 15th - 20th level characters on the Saturday/Sunday session.
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I am fortunate enough that our group all live within an 30 minute drive range. We play every weekend for the most part(excluding holidays, and college football when their teams are playing on tv). Most of the Gm'ng is spread about. When one get burned out or tired, someone else will pick up the reigns and so forth.
GM wise. I have the most fun GM'ng Rolemaster/Harp & Warhammer. Other systems i tend to be just a player.
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I chose, "I am a GM but get to play sometimes" because a more correct option wasn't really available.
I GM by Choice, But would Like to play sometimes, but the chance to play for me doesn't happen very often.
RM groups are hard enough to find, let alone find time for, and I am one of those who finds it a Joy to GM, so I pretty much GM..
If there was a Good PBP game going on I could Join I would play, But I don't see any of those about either.
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I started RPGs (back in the early 80s) in order to GM. Whilst I did play as a player, my main interest in RPGs is GMing, if only because creating and taking care of my own world is my primary hobby: having people enjoying it is merely a good addition. So, regardless of the system, I always choose to GM if I can, and most often in my own world.
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The only thing I miss that I get when playing that you cannot get when GMing is the sense of achievement from the planning, execution and total destruction of your enemy.
As a GM your role is not to totally destroy the party even if your are playing the most evil of evil villains. All of your villains must have some kind of flaw for the heroes to be heroes.
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I started RPGs (back in the early 80s) in order to GM. Whilst I did play as a player, my main interest in RPGs is GMing, if only because creating and taking care of my own world is my primary hobby: having people enjoying it is merely a good addition. So, regardless of the system, I always choose to GM if I can, and most often in my own world.
I am awful at world creation. I can build an amazing town or city, a pretty good country but when I get to continents and worlds I just run out of inspiration. They start to get a little bit generic.
Give me a town to work on and I like to build it in the way a pearl grows inside an oyster, building up layer upon layer. I could tell you the routes of every town guard, where they stop for a tankard of ale, which out lying farms sell their wool to to which weavers. Who is jealous of who and who has affiliations to all the individual guilds. I like designing all the little wheels within wheels that make a town work and have a functioning economy. Who works where and what happens to the people who cannot work.
I can scale that to a country sized system with the trade routes, communication routes and the expoitation of the countries natural resources. The differences in wealth that those resources create and where the seeds of discontent would be greatest.
Take that up to a world and I kind of run out of steam. I couldn't write a book either, two good chapters probably and then you would just have blank pages.
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Over the years we've always had a primary GM, with others (including me) rarely running a game/campaign. The players seem to love it when I run, but I don't enjoy it as much as playing. I don't really enjoy knowing everything, it's more fun when you have to figure it out. Anyhow, I'm working up a new campaign, which now I'm thinking I'll make Sci-Fi.
I was working on a Fantasy setting campaign (all that will just go into mothballs now). Have the foundation for most of the world already done and a layout for the campaign, but when we found out our primary GM was moving I decided to switch over to Sci-Fi. Three primary reasons. #1. I find it easier to put together overall. #2. We haven't really done a good Sci-Fi game. #3. I want some space battles! (i.e. players will have a full on character but there will also be spaceship/space fighter battles).
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I used to have all the spacemaster rules but somewhere in some house move or other they have disappeared. If I wanted to run a Sci Fi game I would have to buy them all again. I would probably go with something Firefly universe based. I like the lo tech/hi tech mix in the firefly series.
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I used to have all the spacemaster rules but somewhere in some house move or other they have disappeared. If I wanted to run a Sci Fi game I would have to buy them all again. I would probably go with something Firefly universe based. I like the lo tech/hi tech mix in the firefly series.
that could be a fin game, I love that series. Would love to play in it.
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As a GM I would just love that moment when things are either going really well or totally belly up for the players and you decide to send in the Reavers.
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Yup totally peter
I am currenty working up my rules for a PBP game that will be a Mix of Post Apoc, Sci-fi with a Little Magic Mixed in.
Character will come from various back grounds of Genre, But will all end-up (each character will start the game solo) on the same back world Planet for one reason or another.
Kind of mixing Firefly, Fallout and Halo.
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I would have loved to say that I get to play sometimes, but I just don't. *Sigh*
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May I ask what PBP stands for?
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Play By Post
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I would have loved to say that I get to play sometimes, but I just don't. *Sigh*
Play By Post is exactly for people who don't have time for a standard session. you should get into one Randalthor.
If you got time to post here :-P you got time or a PBP
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Ah, I always knew that as PBM play by mail.
It just isn't the same as real playing though is it?
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LOL " real playing" makes me laugh.
Okay s no, you don't have the instant reaction and easy comradery of a Face to face or even VOIP game. But, (and I caveat this by saying, it depnds on the GM and game) PBP can be very close to the same thing just spread out over longer periods of time between responses.
I have 1 game I run PBP currently and I play in one as well.
The game forum we use is RPOL.net and it has a Die rolled, and private messaging in posts so that it can run very similar to a regular game. The Game I run currently uses the "Hack Master" (new edition) system, And I run it, even combat, The same as I would in face to face.
I plan to run my RM/SM game the same way.
I used to be down on PB games, as I had a few bad experiences years ago, But again, With the right GM, Right group, it is a Decent play. and IMO is better than not playing at all.
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The last time I did play by mail it really was by mail with about a weeks turn around.
I may Google to see if there are any RM based ones. As they say 'don't knock it until you try it'.
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On RPOL there aren't yet any "Ongoing" RM PBP games that I have found...
the One that was going tos tart a few months ago, fell apart after the first few sessions, first because all the players felt Rail roaded by the GM, more like we were jsut listening to him tell us a story than playing the game. then he rebotted, but after 2 weeks the gm stopped posting. (I think due to ridicule from one of the players involved.)
But, Like I said, I got one I am working to start.
MY Hackmaster game has been going for a Year now, And most the time, the players involved pot daily.
We had one combat that, due to the numbers involved, took about 2 weeks to resolve.
The AD&D game I started playing in recently seems to move fairly well also.
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We have a strange set up where our group live all over the south and south west UK and we all gather a couple of times a year to play but then play all weekend.
The game I play is very much like this. Started in 1995 (quite a bit of turnover in the party, though, two original members, the next one joined in 1999). The game I have started running is a little better, I am aiming for monthly in the less-busy parts of the year. Perhaps 7-8 sessions a year. I also play a World of Darkness Mage game, which used to be every two weeks but turned into a monthly Google Hangout game plus a bit of PBP in between, as the GM moved out of state. And then there is also LARPing.
I enjoy playing and also enjoy GMing. The latter takes more time, which is why I put off starting my own campaign. But ideas build and you have to do something with them.
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If I wanted to run a Sci Fi game I would have to buy them all again. I would probably go with something Firefly universe based. I like the lo tech/hi tech mix in the firefly series.
Actually my thought is to start it in what would seem a Firefly-like setting and just have it a far flung place in space that the Empire hasn't bothered with. As the group becomes higher level and things get more epic... you introduce... (queue the imperial march theme...). Heck, maybe come to find our the Firefly "Alliance" were trying to consolidate systems in a misguided attempt by the local branch in order to help fight back. Just not sure who's side the group would be on. Maybe make them think the Empire is good because they are fighting the (locally) bad Alliance guys, only to find out things get worse... :bang: Muhahahahaaa
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I chose, "I am a GM but get to play sometimes" because a more correct option wasn't really available.
I GM by Choice, But would Like to play sometimes, but the chance to play for me doesn't happen very often.
RM groups are hard enough to find, let alone find time for, and I am one of those who finds it a Joy to GM, so I pretty much GM..
If there was a Good PBP game going on I could Join I would play, But I don't see any of those about either.
I am in the same boat as you. I would love to play RM more, but the group from college is scattered across the US now. The game shop near my home has shut down so the chance to get something going through them is gone. My kids like to play, but that means I am the GM for those sessions. I have been fortunate enough to play with a great group of guys for over a year now, about 3-4 times a month, but it's D20 systems. Tonight, however, I get to introduce the group to RM2, which means I will be again GMing and not playing RM, but I'm hopeful there will be some interest generated to have someone else pick up some books to GM.
My youngest daughter wants to learn how to run a session, so I have been working with her to get some things going, but it's all fun, family bonding things. She absolutely LOVES RM2, so maybe she'll take off with it and we'll have another GM in the family. I've asked her on several occasions if any of her friends play any type and dice games and she sadly admits that none do. What a crying shame. Kids these days aren't staying in playing games nearly as much as they used to. I blame the internet.
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In my year at school there were about 300 students and of those I was ne of five roleplayers. The year above me there were about the same number of students and also five players. In the year above that there were at least four players.
I make that 1.5% of all students or 3% of the male students.
Roleplayers are largely between 15 and 50 years old. They may be younger but I think you probably are not completely hooked until then. Very few are older than 50 because the games did not exist for them to play in their formative years before the late 70s.
That 35 year block respresents about 50% of the population.
If there are 6Billion people on the planet, probably 2 Billion English speakers, 1 Billion are Male.
At about 3% there should be 30Million roleplayers out there. In 2008 it was estimated that 5million copies of the D&D rules had been sold up to and including version 3.5. D&D is not the only fruit so that estimated 30Million is portentially not that far our as not everyone who plays D&D has the rules and not all roleplayers play D&D.
In my town statistically there should be 21 roleplayers. I know 1 other in my age group and there is a an active War Hammer group at the senior school that I know of via one of the teachers. I can proably account for about 8 of the 21. Given that most of us do not advertise the fact that our idea of a fun evening is to sit around with the guys and pretend to be elves, the chances of recognising a fellow roleplayers is slim at best. The chances of finding a GM in need of players is even less probable. The chances of finding a RM GM would be at an estimate of 1 in every 6000 roleplayers.
Mind you there are lies, damned lies and statistics as they say.
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I chose, "I am a GM but get to play sometimes" because a more correct option wasn't really available.
I GM by Choice, But would Like to play sometimes, but the chance to play for me doesn't happen very often.
RM groups are hard enough to find, let alone find time for, and I am one of those who finds it a Joy to GM, so I pretty much GM..
If there was a Good PBP game going on I could Join I would play, But I don't see any of those about either.
I am in the same boat as you. I would love to play RM more, but the group from college is scattered across the US now. The game shop near my home has shut down so the chance to get something going through them is gone. My kids like to play, but that means I am the GM for those sessions. I have been fortunate enough to play with a great group of guys for over a year now, about 3-4 times a month, but it's D20 systems. Tonight, however, I get to introduce the group to RM2, which means I will be again GMing and not playing RM, but I'm hopeful there will be some interest generated to have someone else pick up some books to GM.
My youngest daughter wants to learn how to run a session, so I have been working with her to get some things going, but it's all fun, family bonding things. She absolutely LOVES RM2, so maybe she'll take off with it and we'll have another GM in the family. I've asked her on several occasions if any of her friends play any type and dice games and she sadly admits that none do. What a crying shame. Kids these days aren't staying in playing games nearly as much as they used to. I blame the internet.
This is pretty much where I sit, too. Interestingly enough, most of my games consist of people who either have never played an RPG before or have never played RM in any form, so I've gotten fairly good at working with new or inexperienced players. Most of those groups tend to stay together for at least a year, too, so we've had some good games and good characters. I'd love to be able to play again, but the handful of groups I've seen in my area either play systems that I can't stand or aren't looking to add new players. It was nice when we had a second RM2 GM...we'd more or less trade campaigns back and forth, but it's been some years since I've been able to do that.
I guess I got into GMing because I enjoy creating worlds or game setting (depending on genre). I'm also a bit of a compulsive tinkerer with rules systems, and it's obviously easier to do that when you're GMing.
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Has anyone ever placed a classified ad looking for a GM or players?
"RM GM looking for PCs. Must have good sense humour." It means something to us but would be fairly cryptic to anyone else I would have thought. I imagine it would work in a larger town or university city.
"Willing 46yr old PC desperately seeking GM."
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In my year at school there were about 300 students and of those I was ne of five roleplayers. The year above me there were about the same number of students and also five players. In the year above that there were at least four players.
I make that 1.5% of all students or 3% of the male students.
WotC did a study in 1999 and found that, of people ages 12-35, 6% had played tabletop RPGs and 3% did so at least monthly. 19% of them were female. So, a bit more than your estimate but not by much. Of people who played RPGs, 47% had GMed at least 2 sessions, 41% never GMed.
May have shifted since 1999 but at least it is some real numbers.
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Obviously mine was just a guestimated calculation. Their study was 15 years ago and they top age bracket was 35. Mine was 50 so we are in line there.
With any sponsored survey you always have to be wary of who they asked and what they asked. If they asked a 1000 college students then they would come up with a very skewed result. WotC are not going to release a survey that says their product is generally reviled and only played by loners who have a high probablilty of going postal and killing all their college friends. Instead they are going to publish figures that show their product to be popular with a wide appeal.
I have worked in a statistical marketing function and one of the tricks they use is to ask a great many questions find the ones that support your arguement and then discard the questions that you don't like the answers to. Another method is a 'bucket' things. Q1 Have you played any sort for adventure, fantasy or roleplaying game? Q2 Have you heard of or played Dungeons and Dragons. The first question sets up a bucket that includes a multitude of games from simple facebook time wasters to Rolemaster. The second creates a bucket of people who may have just heard of D&D and lumps them together with the players.
When the marketing igors get hold of the stats you get something like "Nearly all students enjoy playing fantasy, adventure and roleplaying games and most were familiar with Dungeons and Dragons one of the most established blah blah blah." It sounds like all student halls of residence are littered with D4 all over the floor and you cannot walk around without shoes or suffer crippling sole injuries.
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They were actually pretty good about sharing the details. I think the point was to inform their business planning, not to use the results for publicity purposes. Given our demographic here I would have liked if they went over 35, and the analysis of the age distribution is wrong, but otherwise it's pretty solid. Draw your own conclusions if you like. http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/wotcdemo.html
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If there are 6Billion people on the planet, probably 2 Billion English speakers, (...)
Uh? Where do you get this figure? Two billions that may know English, mayhap, but most would only know it as a second or third language and wouldn't be likely to commonly read/play in English. There are 300 millions people in the USA, 25 in Australia and 65 millions in the UK, so you don't even have half a billion actual English speakers.
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As GM, I get to play every minute of the game, and a CAST of characters at that. I am involved in every action, every combat, every discussion.
I GM by choice. Granted initially, many years ago, it was pushed upon me, but I have come to eagerly embrace it, as I also get to determine the story the players will get to tell, the world they game in, the magic in the world, what is available, etc. The game is always entertaining for me, the GM. And OH how we laugh ;D
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I didn't get the figures from anywhere. I just made them all up. The chances are that if you over estimate one number you will under estimate another and the errors tend to cancel out. It is a technique popularised by Enrico Fermi, the physicist.
I was actually lumping in many of those that speak English as a second and third language. I know a number of Swiss and Norwegian gamers that buy the English language rule books because they are available first or only in English.
On the other hand I have only ever known two female gamers and I excluded them from my little numbers game as I thought a total sample size of two was too small to extrapolate from. So I over estimated the audience size and under estimated the gaming population.
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They were actually pretty good about sharing the details. I think the point was to inform their business planning, not to use the results for publicity purposes. Given our demographic here I would have liked if they went over 35, and the analysis of the age distribution is wrong, but otherwise it's pretty solid. Draw your own conclusions if you like. http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/wotcdemo.html
Their sample size was 1000 people who had returned a card stating that they were interested in gaming. This is a segmentation report based upon the games industry in the US.
I agree that it is to do with their business planning and they were identifying the major areas of gaming cross over in order to reach new roleplayers.
Someone in an earlier post said they blamed the internet and they are right to a degree. I blame social media. When I was 12-16 I would go around a mates house to hang out and roleplaying fitted into that 'mates together, what shall we do?' need perfectly.
My kids are now 16 - 23yrs old and only the eldest ever really used to hang out with mates. The others all spend too much time at home glued to facebook, instagram, whatsapp and snapchat. They just do not go out and socialise.
Even the WotC report notes that there were less new gamers coming through.
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If there are 6Billion people on the planet, probably 2 Billion English speakers, (...)
Uh? Where do you get this figure? Two billions that may know English, mayhap, but most would only know it as a second or third language and wouldn't be likely to commonly read/play in English. There are 300 millions people in the USA, 25 in Australia and 65 millions in the UK, so you don't even have half a billion actual English speakers.
Doing a little research puts it at 1.3 Billion. That's includes ALL English speakers, even if it is a second language.
(And this is likely a little low because the statistic had a disclaimer that all "All eligible" regarding the populations. Not sure what would make you ineligible).
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Yes a GM I knew in California placed adds in a newspaper, local game shops and online in the mid to late 90's looking for RM players. It was quite an interesting mix of people that he got with some staying and some leaving do to his style of game or I should say long running campaign (since the early 80's).
BTW, he and his wife were involved in RoCo 1 to a fair extent by his telling.
MDC
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Yes a GM I knew in California placed adds in a newspaper, local game shops and online in the mid to late 90's looking for RM players. It was quite an interesting mix of people that he got with some staying and some leaving do to his style of game or I should say long running campaign (since the early 80's).
BTW, he and his wife were involved in RoCo 1 to a fair extent by his telling.
MDC
Likely the primary author, I'd guess, if his telling is accurate. RMC 1 really seemed to be the product of one campaign (which in my view made it one of the strongest of the companions).
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If there are 6Billion people on the planet, probably 2 Billion English speakers, (...)
Uh? Where do you get this figure? Two billions that may know English, mayhap, but most would only know it as a second or third language and wouldn't be likely to commonly read/play in English. There are 300 millions people in the USA, 25 in Australia and 65 millions in the UK, so you don't even have half a billion actual English speakers.
Doing a little research puts it at 1.3 Billion. That's includes ALL English speakers, even if it is a second language.
(And this is likely a little low because the statistic had a disclaimer that all "All eligible" regarding the populations. Not sure what would make you ineligible).
Maybe the popuĺation is regarded as English speaking but literacy level is not 100%
If we take it as 1 Billion people that would still give us a theoretical roleplayer population of 15 million people. It is quite a big market place. Does anyone know the rough marketshare ICE has?
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Less than one percent. Also, not every player will buy a rulebook, much less an expansion. Typical gaming books do not sell a huge number of copies. 1000 is pretty great. Look at RPGNow, HARP made Gold, and Silver on DriveThroughRPGs (these are based on separate tallies). That means it sold something in the range of 602-1250 copies if what I read elsewhere is true.
I don't think randomly meeting people and asking them if they know RM is a good strategy to meet RM players. Better to find a way to interact with gamers, whether at your FLGS, a gaming con, a LARP, etc. And joining existing games even if they aren't RM. If they turn out to be people worth playing with, you can later run RM, or pitch it.
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Ah, I always knew that as PBM play by mail.
It just isn't the same as real playing though is it?
Sorry Warl, but I have to agree here. I tried PBP once and loosing the social interaction part just made it feel flat to me. Sitting at the table with people just "feels" better. To me it is like the calling someone vs texting, sure texting is great for just shooting someone a quick message when you don't need a response, but if you are going to be carrying on a conversation, just friggin call, please. It is faster and "feels" better because I can hear them and that gives me inflections that are lost in texting. To get the same inflections in texting (or PBP) I have to do all sorts of "quotes", italisized, bold, underlined, and the ever popular "quotes/italisized/bold/underlined", all of which are a pain to do. Also, as I like long campaigns where the characters go far and do lots of stuff, but I rarely get to stick with any game/campaign for very long, the uber-slow process would really bug me.
A skype game might work, but only so long as the connection is good. It still wouldn't be as good as face-to-face, imo though.
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Ah, I always knew that as PBM play by mail.
It just isn't the same as real playing though is it?
Sorry Warl, but I have to agree here. I tried PBP once and loosing the social interaction part just made it feel flat to me. Sitting at the table with people just "feels" better. To me it is like the calling someone vs texting, sure texting is great for just shooting someone a quick message when you don't need a response, but if you are going to be carrying on a conversation, just friggin call, please. It is faster and "feels" better because I can hear them and that gives me inflections that are lost in texting. To get the same inflections in texting (or PBP) I have to do all sorts of "quotes", italisized, bold, underlined, and the ever popular "quotes/italisized/bold/underlined", all of which are a pain to do. Also, as I like long campaigns where the characters go far and do lots of stuff, but I rarely get to stick with any game/campaign for very long, the uber-slow process would really bug me.
A skype game might work, but only so long as the connection is good. It still wouldn't be as good as face-to-face, imo though.
Of course it is better to have a face to face game. I never stated anything that implied otherwise.
What I said was, that if you can find a good pbp, it us better than no game at all.
I used to be such a table top snob that I thumbed my nose at pbp games, until I had no other options when I was truck driving. Then I discovered thst, though not as great as face to face, it was an enjoyable substitute for the situation.
Half the issue is attitude. If you go into with a negative out look, that is likely what you will take out of it.
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Also, in general, PBM has a much larger time dilation than a pbp game. All dependant on how often the players and gas check in and post.
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I have tried PBM when I was at college and the lack of responsiveness was the killer.
I tried MUDs but they are way too shallow.
We tried Skype type playing using a service called ooVoo that allowed us to see all the players and GM at the same time. The technology seemed to get in the way and one of the guys had a very poor connection. I felt very self conscious doing it as well. That sort of withered away, I guess others felt the same discomfort.
I am prepared to have a crack at PBP.
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Less than one percent. Also, not every player will buy a rulebook, much less an expansion. Typical gaming books do not sell a huge number of copies. 1000 is pretty great. Look at RPGNow, HARP made Gold, and Silver on DriveThroughRPGs (these are based on separate tallies). That means it sold something in the range of 602-1250 copies if what I read elsewhere is true.
I think part of the problem is that I have the core books for the version I play, all the players and the other GM have the same set of books. We have not added any suppliments to these rulebooks for decades. I have replaced dead paper books and I have bought pdf copies but I and all the guys I play with are not buying new material. The only exception is that the other GM is a Shadow World fan and is buying everything Shadow World.
A second issue is that everyone expects everything for free now. There is a thread on here about creating an online catalogue of PCs with previous versions of their character sheets. The idea being that you can post your favourite PC and it can become an NPC in another persons campaign. Basically they want a Heroes and Rogues for free. I guess that is the desire behind so many requests for ever more feature rich character generators.
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Many many moons ago, I tried to get a PBM going with the group of RM friends I had. It was when BBS's were still new and e-mail was this amazing new thing that only computers nerds and geeks knew about. I had figured it would be like a "Choose your own adventure" book. You read a page, make a choice at the bottom of the page, then turn to a completely different section of the book to see what the consequences of the choice were.
After graduation, all of my friends graduated college and went their separate ways. After not having anyone left to game with, I tried to find some way to manage. Of course it's not as fun or as hilarious as face to face, and not as immediate, but after 5 years of not being able to play ANY type of RM gaming session, it was welcome.
I just found the Real Roleplaying site that is in the banner ad on this forum and I checked it out. The problem I see is finding a group of players who will check in frequently enough to make the game play fun. Too much lag between posts and it loses the fun. With internet being so prolific in our lives and everyone getting email on their phones, laptops, tablets, in their car, the response times should be much faster than 30 years ago when you had to wait for mom to get off the phone so you could dial into the BBS on your 300bps modem and hope no one picked up the phone while you were online or call waiting kicked you off.
I miss playing/GMing RM so much, I am all for a PBM/PBP forum. When I am at work and there is a lull, I can send in my responses and actions or respond to the player posts.
It's not as fun as face to face, but it's better than going years not playing at all.
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I am now checking the rpol site on a daily basis hoping for some RM games to pop up.
I'm not going to knock before I have tried it. I find forums fun so pbp should moer so.
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A fiend on mine ran a PBP game that had 30 people in it so it took him a lot longer to manage the game than people realized. So I would guess like any RPG game you GM it can take quite a bit of work on the back end to get a good front end.
MDC
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A fiend on mine ran a PBP game that had 30 people in it so it took him a lot longer to manage the game than people realized. So I would guess like any RPG game you GM it can take quite a bit of work on the back end to get a good front end.
MDC
30 people is a massive undertaking! Wow. In sessions where we had 8+ people playing, we would have another GM assist to keep the game moving along a little quicker. If the party split up to do separate things in town, the 2nd GM could handle some of the interaction and dice rolls while the primary GM handled the plot-line interactions. It was extremely helpful for combat.
I haven't had any real time experience with the PBP yet, but I would think 12-15 would be the MAX I would want to try to GM or to be a PC. 30 replies to send out in one sitting a lot of work! How did it go for the GM? How long was he able to keep the campaign going?
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A fiend on mine ran a PBP game....
Please, please please tell me that is not a typo!
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I have tried PBM when I was at college and the lack of responsiveness was the killer.
I tried MUDs but they are way too shallow.
We tried Skype type playing using a service called ooVoo that allowed us to see all the players and GM at the same time. The technology seemed to get in the way and one of the guys had a very poor connection. I felt very self conscious doing it as well. That sort of withered away, I guess others felt the same discomfort.
I am prepared to have a crack at PBP.
I actually Run a Ventrilo VOIP Game, where we also use a VTT (virtual Table top) called Maptools.
Been running this way in one game (Hackmaster) for 4 years now.
I have a Rolemaster game that has been running now for over 6 months using the same interfaces and it's going great.
The Rolemaster game runs every other sunday 7pm MST to 10-12 MST, you would be welcome if you wanted/available to join. Or even to come lurk to see how it goes.
As for PBP on RPOL.... IF you don't Mind a Modified game, I am not ready to start the game yet, I am currently working on my character creation Flow thread, I Hope to have character creation up and running by the end of the month. But it is a mix of RM and Spacemaster.
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That is very kind of you!
The Sunday night sessions would would be 2am - 5am for me. Anything past midnight for me these days and I am spouting gibberish.
A spacemaster/RM game sounds fun. End of the month is cool. I have my head down putting the finishing touches on the first session of my Forgotten Realms RM game that starts on the 10th of Oct. I am also working on an article for the Adventurers Guild. That should keep me out of trouble.
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Sorry my fiend was a friend ;D , but yes the play by email game went on for over a year and then was relaunched after a year to two year break with about 15 players. BTW it was set is Water World, the setting of the film of the same name.
He also ran another PBeM I like Play By eMail better but that is probably just me as most people do not remember play by post, which was also a huge success. He was a very prolific typer and writer as you could imagine. ;D
MDC
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As for duel GM's I was at a Con (way back when) and played in a D&D game that had 10-16 players and 2 GM's. It was a blast to see that it could be done and that the 2 guys were really on the same page when it came to the GM tasks.
MDC
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Never worked with another GM. I have run split party games before (espionage setting...one group was CIA the other was GRU). It was a lot of work, but pretty fun.
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Never worked with another GM. I have run split party games before (espionage setting...one group was CIA the other was GRU). It was a lot of work, but pretty fun.
That seems like a cool concept and would work really well with PBM setting with only the GM knowing the facts and actions of both sides and either side only knowing what the GM relates to them. Eliminates meta gaming by the players.
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Never worked with another GM. I have run split party games before (espionage setting...one group was CIA the other was GRU). It was a lot of work, but pretty fun.
That seems like a cool concept and would work really well with PBM setting with only the GM knowing the facts and actions of both sides and either side only knowing what the GM relates to them. Eliminates meta gaming by the players.
Yeah...I did it FtF, though. Usually what happened is one group met at one time, and the other would meet at another time. They did come together from time to time, and that was interesting. On the whole it worked pretty well, but it is also well-suited for PBM or a play by post with sub-forums.
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Ya , I tried that once ft and it turned into a pissing/pvp contest.
So if I did/do it again, it will be via forums
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We once ran two full groups, 5-6 each, in two different rooms in the same house. The two GM's wore headsets to talk to each other (in order to relay information, like the sound of a fireball going off or things like that). The two parties were going through a mirror image of the same dungeon. About halfway through it came together once in a room with a magical wall that no living material could pass through down the center (I suspect that thought we might try to make ranged attacks and each other if we found ourselves in it at the same time) and the overall dungeon ended in the same large room. The first party there got an advantage and it was a party-v-party combat at the end. While there can be some frustration when combating a whole separate party it actually worked well overall. However, due to one person specifically, it got a little ugly at the end due to his attitude.
The room with the magical wall - we figured out no living matter could go through it. So I, being the Cleric (D&D), went back and animated the corpse of a troll, had it go to the other side of the room and spike the door shut from the inside. The other GM said they spent more time trying to figure out how we did that then they did actually breaking the door down. Got a chuckle out of that. We really didn't physically slow them down, but they wasted a bunch of time trying to figure it out.
The ugly end bit... we had the enemy party cast "web spells" in the stairwell we had to come down into the final room. We had lighting bolted one of their members (to death), so I decided to animate him, douse him with oil, set him on fire and send him into the webs. The entire point was to get rid of the webs. Well, the individual with the attitude problem threw this huge fit that we were intentionally being disrespectful and thumbing our noses at him (which was a silly reaction). That player didn't last long with our group(s).
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so I decided to animate him, douse him with oil, set him on fire and send him into the webs. The entire point was to get rid of the webs. Well, the individual with the attitude problem threw this huge fit that we were intentionally being disrespectful and thumbing our noses at him (which was a silly reaction). That player didn't last long with our group(s).
That's an awesome idea! We actually had players volunteer their corpses so we could continue with a full party! He just wanted to be an undead. Luckily, very luckily, the group I am with now is really good to game with and they have no problems like that. However, I have experienced those types of players in the past. One was so pissed off (A knight profession) that he sat down in the middle of battle and refused to take any actions. Are you kidding me? You're a knight, you have 4 undead around you and you sit down and do nothing?
He didn't last long either.
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I have seen players up and leave in the middle of a session when things went against them and we had one player who we now know suffered(s) from Schitzophrenia. He accused another player of cheating and he hasn't spoken to that player now for over 20yrs despite they come into contact not infrequently.
You never know what is going on behind the eyes.
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I've only just blatantly walked out on one game. Back in our D&D days one of the group members decided to run a game. When I came to roll up a character I was handed three d6 to roll stats. I did so, they kinda stunk. We were used to using the optional system when you picked what you wanted to be and your stat rolls were weighted in that direction, but I decided to be a good sport.
So I asked if we were allowed re-rolls.
Nope.
Could I assign them as I see fit?
Nope. In the order rolled.
Can I swap 2 for 1 on stats?
Nope. You got what you got.
But I wanted to play a melee fighter of some sort.
Sorry, with your stats you're going to have to play mage.
Seriously? That sucks.
That's how my game works.
Well your game sucks (and I left).
I later heard the opening scene of the game was the party being Fire-balled in the darkness. One player was killed, one went down, another was left with only a few hit points. One or two of the players that went down had to wait like 4 hours for the fight to be done and get healed. They didn't return. So I am pretty sure a dodged a bullet on that one.
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I never really got the rational behind restricting classes. Sure Paladins are rare but PCs represent probably less than 0.1% of the population.
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Yeah, there really no point in a character creation system where you can roll up a character with stats that doesn't let you play what you want. We called them "Farmers" when we played D&D. "Hey look, I rolled up another farmer! He goes on his merry way..." (start rolling again).
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A skype game might work, but only so long as the connection is good. It still wouldn't be as good as face-to-face, imo though.
The RMFRP game I GM has been running (in various forms) since the mid 90's. A few years back, I moved to another country, but that didn't stop the game. Skype gaming works fine for us!
All of the players are in a lounge room in Australia, with the GM (me) on the big TV screen, Skyping in from New Zealand. For quiet asides to a player, the player goes into the study and I Skype into there for a quick chat. I've tried a few of the online tools, but I've gone back to just sketching maps on a bit of A4 and holding that up to the camera as required. A decent omnidirectional mike on the player end is essential.
As good as actually being there? No, but it's pretty close. I do think it wouldn't work as well if all the players were Skyping in from different locations as well as myself, but the fact that they still all get together in the same place, with the same junk food and social interaction, really seems to make it work.
And I'm not sure it would work as well if I was a player, rather than the GM, and the GM and the rest of the group were in one location that I was Skyping into remotely.
You do need a reasonable internet connection for this. Skype's pretty good at handling problem connections, but we have had one or two games that I've needed to stop early due to persistent problems, and I don't think we've ever had a session where I haven't needed to hang up and call back once or twice.
But all in all, I've found it works quite well.
Regards,
- David.
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We have done the "All players and Gm on a Oovoo video call (Oovoo allows up to 12 connections at once for free) as Well as we have also had Players join the my local home FtF game via the same Oovoo program and it has worked out well.
Doing the same using a Virtual table top has work very well as well. been doing virtual table tops now for over 10 years.
We use a Separate voice program from VTT, but Free site programs like Roll20 have the Video conferencing built in.
I have even considered using Virtual Meeting programs for the game, but I like to have my maps Premade and love the fog of war and so forth. Even if I went back to being able to run a FTF game, I would still use the virtual table top for maps. I have it set up to my 40" LED tv and it has worked that way well in the past for my FTF games.
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Right now I am the GM. Maybe some day I won't be the only GM but oh well.
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welcome to the forums Azaghal
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Welcome Azaghal.
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I was a player back in 93, and once I started buying RMSS I became a GM. Though I have not touched the books in almost seven years, my oldest daughter wants to learn. Thankfully, while sorting some old garage clutter I found a disc of my old RMC books, and now have the books to make her chuckle or cringe at the number 66.
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I was a player back in 93, and once I started buying RMSS I became a GM. Though I have not touched the books in almost seven years, my oldest daughter wants to learn. Thankfully, while sorting some old garage clutter I found a disc of my old RMC books, and now have the books to make her chuckle or cringe at the number 66.
A warm welcome to you and your family. :) It's a great feeling having family game night and everyone playing RM is my family. It's a blast, helps us bond, teaches cooperation, and it's great to be able to share and to create new memories while gaming. My 12 year old daughter wants to be GM now so I let her help me set up the campaign plot for the one I am running for the gaming group I meet with on Mondays. She's having a great time going through the books and learning what the stats mean and how each creature stacks up against the party.
Keep in mind, at the end of the first night she played, when she was about 8 years old, she grabbed the pen from me, drew a new map, drew a goblin and some trees and told me that one more goblin was getting away and that *I* had to roll initiative to go get him!
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I'm impressed for my party drawing their swords is their answer to everything right now.
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I GM because it's my calling. :-)
I do play in a few games, but mostly I'm super picky. I get bored fast. I have one person who I play with when he's in town, and outside that I generally organize, GM and evangelize (prognosticate?).
Just read through most of RMU and I've very impressed. So I'm poking about the boards to take the pulse, and see what's up.
I would posit that most of the people you find online are UBER. The serious enthusiasts (like me!) who dig a little deeper into this fine hobby. Most players use "player finders" and Meetup to find games, then happily play them. :-) This is IMHO, IME, etc.
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i GM in my group but the players have had experience as GM of other games. so we share the GMing but i am the exclusive RM GM. here is a link to my campaign which we have restarted after over a 20yr break!
http://www.ironcrown.com/ICEforums/index.php?topic=15580.0
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I just read your campaign background, very good! I have noticed with my little experience of pbp gaming that the NPC interactions are better and add more to the game than they have in true face to face games so what you said about pre-scripting was interesting.
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I just read your campaign background, very good! I have noticed with my little experience of pbp gaming that the NPC interactions are better and add more to the game than they have in true face to face games so what you said about pre-scripting was interesting.
Hi Peter. Yes playing online does have a different feel and i agree that PCs get a bit more of a chance to shine and develop a bit more depth, perhaps because you have more time to develop them offline for each session and i think that depth is needed to ground the players in the setting.
I have found it useful to have npc allies for my players who can offer suggestions for decisions for their characters. Sometimes these can be conflicting (between NPCs and btween players and NPC's - just like in real life people will disagree about things). In my Thieves World campaign the pcs have sided with a group of mercenary types called Hawkmasks. These hawkmasks are part of a larger group working for a crimelord and essentually function as the crimelords enforcers around the city and are sent on jobs of a criminal nature. The pcs are lower level than a few of the more experienced Hawkmasks and therefore are lower on the pecking order and get told what to do most of the time however one pc is moving up the ranks and is 3rd or 4th in command so he gets more say in decisions. The two Hawkmask captains occasionally disagree on what the group should be doing so it sometimes falls on the pcs to cast the deciding vote. Its created an interesting dynamic within the group where 3-4 characters (one pc and 3 NPC's) are leading the group and get input into big decisions that effect the whole group.
I am quite proud of the fact that many of the NPCs interacting with the pcs are my own creations. There are a few more powerful guys the players have heard of but not met yet. I find it is important to play npcs as realistically as possible and keep them true to their goals and motivations, often these motivations involve money or power so its not that hard to imagine how the would behave.
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EDIT: ...i agree that NPCs get a bit more of a chance to shine and develop a bit more depth...
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In the past I tended to GM RM mostly. More recently I run a RM game and play in one. I like having the option of character time - a game night where I don't have to run the show is always nice.
As a side note, I pretty much refuse to GM D&D / Pathfinder any longer. I have played in several games in recent years mostly because the rest of the group prefers GM'ing Pathfinder systems and I enjoy our game nights. I also figure it is polite to participate, etc.
One of the group says "Dude, it's like D&D is s--- for you compared to RM." I would not go that far, but he is basically correct. I just can't do it...
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I'd play a lot of different games (some under protest)... but if I run the game, I pick the rules.
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I'd play a lot of different games (some under protest)... but if I run the game, I pick the rules.
I totally agree. Especially when you consider the hours of prep that as GM you need to commit to.
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to me the prep as GM is sort of a labour of love. its hard work but u know it is going to pay off down the road. its quite important to stay in tune with your players so you can focus ur prep around the areas of your world u expect then to visit. having comprehensive resource books to support your world is the secret to easing the prep. i dont think players really appreciate how much thought and time goes into crafting a vibrant roleplaying setting. letting different people in ur playgroup GM will show them how much work it is tho.
I'd play a lot of different games (some under protest)... but if I run the game, I pick the rules.
I totally agree. Especially when you consider the hours of prep that as GM you need to commit to.
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Yes but what I meant was that to all those hours of prep in a game system you don't like or does not allow you to realise your vision is very frustrating and not particularly fun.
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Yes but what I meant was that to all those hours of prep in a game system you don't like or does not allow you to realise your vision is very frustrating and not particularly fun.
so why are you GMing a game system you dont enjoy?
there must be some other options available to you.
why not create your own? Or if that is too big of a task, take the best bits from different game systems.
there is a new version of Lord of the Rings/MERP that looks great. If u was wanting to start again, id go for that.
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I'm not, and I didn't say I was. I was just agreeing with jdale that if one is the GM then the GM should be able to choose the system.