Topic: Ghost Level

[Lorgalis]

I Wonder what experienced GMs think about a new thing I'm trying out on a new party.

I call it "ghost level" inspired by ghost notes in music.

Each player creates a 1 lvl character as usual, but in addition he gets to develop skills one extra time. The dev points must be spent with the skill costs for the "No profession" profession.
- Dev points may not be spent on magical skills.
- you don't get any level bonuses for the ghost level.
- you still make resistance rolls as if you were 1 lvl.
- you don't get to roll for stat gain.

The reason I introduced this, was because we like the idea of packages from RMSS. And in RMSS you get adolescence ranks that fits your race.
We considered starting the party in lvl 2 or 3, but we want the characters to be completely new to adventuring.

Now they can also afford some secondary "useless" skills like wood carving, music etc. to reflect their background.
And the spell users get a chance to get a few more hit points and maybe +10 in OB that they can use to parry in an unwanted melee situation.

Any opinions? Stupid idea? Good idea? Will it affect the balance?

[Sable Wyvern]

Seems like a reasonable way to make characters that are a little more powerful and/or a little more well-rounded.

Personally, I'd allow the magical skills, unless you're going for a low-magic feeling overall. If a fighter chooses to develop something, it's not as if one level worth of points are going to make them massively powerful archmages (at best, they get, what, 5 levels of an open list?), and a spell using character will soon have any bonus ranks overshadowed by their regular progression.

Can't see how it could possibly be unbalanced, since all PCs are using the same rules. Obviously, they'll all be a little tougher early on, but I can't see it causing any problems, especially given how mediocre 1st level characters tend to be (I can't really visualise a 1st level RM character as anything other than someone in very early adolescence).

[Spectre771]

Is this ghost level really necessary though?  RM2 has the adolescent development level which is essentially level 0.  The players buy skills at level 0, then again at level 1, giving them "2 levels" worth of skills but still remain level 1.  This seems to be the same thing you're doing now without raising the cost of skills to No Profession costs and without the magic restrictions.

As the GM, you can start your players at level you'd like.  For 25+ years we've started players at level 5 but sent them against level 5+ NPCs.  On resistance rolls vs. level 5 attacks it was still 1-1 or 50% chance of success.   It gave the players more survivability and gave the GMs more baddies to draw from to make the games interesting.  A level 2 or 3 or 5 character can still be completely new to adventuring.  They just waited until a little later in life to leave the village.

I've just recently started a new group of level 1's and we're having a blast with just level 0 and level 1 stats.  As GM, you have to choose carefully what you send against them.

[Sable Wyvern]

I also prefer just increasing starting level. However, this proposal is somewhat different - it promotes slightly more well-rounded characters, as certain skills normally outside the professions's area of expertise will be cheaper. It is somewhat similar to the MERP or RMSS adolescent development in that respect, in that the ranks earned aren't tied to profession.

I wouldn't do things this way, but I don't see any harm in it.

[RandalThor]

I, for one, don't think that each level needs to reflect adventuring. They could just as easily reflect training, perhaps they were apprenticed for a bit longer.

Overall, the "Ghost Level" thing doesn't seem to be needed, just make training packages if you like them. Take the ones from RMSS/FRP and adjust for the RMC way of not having skill categories, just use the individual skills, and instead of them using DP just say each PC can pick one TP. You should do your best to balance them in terms of DP cost so that there aren't the ones that are clearly better than the others.

[Lorgalis]

That's a lot of work...

Instead my players can look at all the packages in the RMSS books to get inspiration for their backgrounds. If they want their character to have worked as a city guard before adventuring, they buy the skill ranks to reflect that. That was also a reason I introduced the ghost level.

We have been the same group since ca 1990 so my players are experienced. They really like the ghost level so far.
Maybe because I am a brutal GM... They have reached 10 lvl only once...

[Spectre771]

Maybe because I am a brutal GM... They have reached 10 lvl only once...

Brutal GM or RM has brutal crits?

[Majyk]

Way to keep the group alive, Lorgalis!

I, too, had the same group since high school mid-88 until an injury made me too pain-brained to GM off the cuff.
Keep the love alive with whatever rules you wanna make or remove.  It’s RM, where that’s allowed.

[brole]

Sounds like a good idea. Especially if you use alot of extra skills.

My take on it is to have an extra level of development spent as normal called 'Journeyman'. So a human background could be as follows.

1. Adolescent eg.13-15 yrs
2. Apprenticeship eg. 16-17 yrs
3. Journeyman eg. 18-19 yrs
4. Level 1. 20+ yrs

If anything the adolescence level should be developed at no-profession costs to reflect when the character had not yet specialised in their profession.

I Wonder what experienced GMs think about a new thing I'm trying out on a new party.

I call it "ghost level" inspired by ghost notes in music.

Each player creates a 1 lvl character as usual, but in addition he gets to develop skills one extra time. The dev points must be spent with the skill costs for the "No profession" profession.
- Dev points may not be spent on magical skills.
- you don't get any level bonuses for the ghost level.
- you still make resistance rolls as if you were 1 lvl.
- you don't get to roll for stat gain.

The reason I introduced this, was because we like the idea of packages from RMSS. And in RMSS you get adolescence ranks that fits your race.
We considered starting the party in lvl 2 or 3, but we want the characters to be completely new to adventuring.

Now they can also afford some secondary "useless" skills like wood carving, music etc. to reflect their background.
And the spell users get a chance to get a few more hit points and maybe +10 in OB that they can use to parry in an unwanted melee situation.

Any opinions? Stupid idea? Good idea? Will it affect the balance?

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[rafmeister]

I have been playing in RM2 groups that have used Childhood+Adolescent+ Apprenticeship to form level one characters. On top of that, about twenty ranks of additional skills were provided to adolescent and apprentice levels. The result favored specific classes: magicians, healers, and other spell users with high costs for general use skills.

For most campaigns, i advise against it. Explore each character's backstory for the first and second level adventures. This will provide an anchor for future roleplaying. If that does not suit your group, just advance everyone to third level and start the campaign there.