Topic: Stun Relief - RMC vs "old school" Rolemaster

[phydaux42]

I was flipping through my pdfs, and I noticed that instant spells are handeled much differently than I remember, in particular Stun Relief.

As I recall back in the day when someone got a "stunned" result on the crit tables, Stun Relief would automatically fire off.  The character could then act as normal, that is to say he could attack.  He just couldn't cast a spell since he had already cast one that turn.

Now it seems that RMC uses a percent action system, and casting an "instant" spell takes 75% of your action.  That doesn't seem very instant.  In fact, according to the Actions table in Arms Law about the only thing you can do with only 25% of your action remaining is stand up from a chair.

So the question becomes "What good is Stun Relief?"

[Marc R]

IMO it's still better than being stunned. . .

Also, if you want instants more instant, use the faster instants options 5.1 or 5.2 on page 30.

[yammahoper]

It may be better than being stun no parry, but not stunned.  While stunned you can parry with half your ob after -50 penalty.  If your GM uses the x3sd to offset that penalty, even better, and you can STILL parry, which you cannot do after casting stun relief.

The answer is to make instant spells only require 10% activity.  If subconcious it does not require an action.

[Marc R]

Depends. . .Stun Relief V "wasting" a round is better than being stunned (or SNP) for 5. . .long stun relief can be cast on another, so you "waste" your round but unstun someone else to act.

That said, I too tend to use the 5.2 "Quick Instant Spells" at 10%.

[markc]

 As a house rule you can make some spells more instant than others. Or you can have the spells on specific spell lists being able to cast faster than others on other spell lists.


MDC

[kevinmccollum]

Well, at the very least, if you cast the stun relief, attacks against you won't get the +20 for being against a stunned opponent.

As to taking -50 before half-parrying, there is nothing indicating you take a -50 penalty. Just half your OB.

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

I was flipping through my pdfs, and I noticed that instant spells are handeled much differently than I remember, in particular Stun Relief.

The actual rules are often very different from what folks remember. For example, I would feel safe in guessing that you didn't use the core RM2 tactical system (i.e the Phases) - http://www.ironcrown.com/ICEforums/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=item578 - which is actually where the  75% activity for an "Instantaneous" spell originally came from.

In fact, many people didn't realize that when the original authors used the word "Instantaneous" in regards to spells, they weren't actually talking about how long it took to cast them, but referring to the fact that none of those spells EVER required preparation rounds, and thus could ALWAYS be cast instantaneously (i.e. right away)

As I recall back in the day when someone got a "stunned" result on the crit tables, Stun Relief would automatically fire off.  The character could then act as normal, that is to say he could attack.  He just couldn't cast a spell since he had already cast one that turn.

More than likely, your group used house rules, and quite possibly used its own tactical system rather than the one from the core books (many people, myself included, did this).

As others have suggested, there is always Option 5.2 on page 30 which basically reduces the total activity of an Instantaneous spell to 10%...

Now it seems that RMC uses a percent action system, and casting an "instant" spell takes 75% of your action.  That doesn't seem very instant.  In fact, according to the Actions table in Arms Law about the only thing you can do with only 25% of your action remaining is stand up from a chair.

Reread page 30 of the RMC Spell Law. Casting the Instantaneous spells only takes 10% activity, the other 65% activity being a recovery period from the instantaneous casting. So yes, while it takes 75% in total, the Instantaneous spell goes off first (since it is considered a Short Action).

So the question becomes "What good is Stun Relief?"

Stun Relief isn't in there so that you can get rid of the stun and attack in the same round. That was never its purpose. Its purpose was to get rid of the stun, period. Being stunned makes you easier to hit and hurt. Having the stun go away, even if you cannot attack in the same round, is VERY beneficial.

Additionally, Stun Relief is (in almost, if not all cases) a subconscious spell. Which means that so long as you are the same level or higher, and have the PP available, the spell will go off automatically, without you having to worry about too much (i.e. it only fails on an 01-02).

[phydaux42]

We used Magic - Missle - Movement - Melee because that is what was in our books..  We didn't go to Fire Phase A & Fire Phase B until space Master came out.

[Marc R]

Based on the original rules without any house rules or options, as said above, "instants" just means you can cast it in one round with no prep rounds, regardless of level. . .Options later in the books made instants take 50% or later 10% action to cast.

Those options were included in RMC as 5.1 and 5.2.

You were using an optional rule all along, just so long you likely forgot it was an option, not the core rule. That came up for us a lot when we were editing/re-writing out the RMC project. . .we'd say "Hell, that's the core rule?" We'd been using option X or Y for so long we'd forgotten what the core rule was. . .

[Marrethiel]

You were using an optional rule all along, just so long you likely forgot it was an option, not the core rule. That came up for us a lot when we were editing/re-writing out the RMC project. . .we'd say "Hell, that's the core rule?" We'd been using option X or Y for so long we'd forgotten what the core rule was. . .

I just bought the RMC core pdfs because I can't find the first 34 pages of my RM1 Character and Campaign Law. It is amazing reading through this for the first time in ages just what we've been doing "wrong". I'll be having some interesting discussion with the group next weekend