Topic: A question about 'resist damage' spell

[choc]

I'm sorry but i found nothing about in the forum archives.

I have a question about the resist admage spell.

The textbook example says: Caster is able to ignore the effects of one Light critical for the duration of the spell.

# The first one?
# A chosen one?
# All light damage while spell is active?

If it's only the first one, why then an improve duration scaling option?

Any examples for this spell? Please help.

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

What is a "Light Critical" is described in the section on Healing.

If cast before the character has been hurt, it will allow him to ignore the first such critical. If it is cast after he has been hurt, it allows him to ignore any one Light Critical of his choosing

The spell allows a character to ignore the effects of a Light critical for the duration of the spell. That means that he acts without any penalties from the crit, or any other drawbacks. The damage is still there, the character just ignores its effects upon until the duration is over.

As for the scaling options for duration -- think of the messenger who rides with an arrow in his back, and still delivers the message many miles away, only to pass out when it is delivered.  In short, it is there to allow the character to function normally for a longer duration before the crit effects.

[Pat]

So a "Light critical" or light damage, the way I read it is: Any injury or injuries with a toal penalty of -25 or less. Bleeding wounds totaling 5 Hits per round or less or damage up to 25% of the characters total hit points.

So, as a GM, I would allow the player to either:
1) Ignore the first 25 points of a penalty
2) Ignore the first 5 bleed per round
3) Ignore the first 25% of the players total hit points in damage.

However, if the spell was cast prior to the critical, then the player would be protected from the first damage taken. But, if the damage had multiple effects (ie 10 hits damage, bleed 3/round and -20) I would allow the player to choose whichever critical effect they wanted.

However number 2, if the severity of the critical was greater than a "Light" critical, then the spell would have no effect (ie Bleeding at 6 hits per round would not be reduced to bleed 1 per round. Instead, the spell would not have activated but would still be available if a smaller attack occurred.)

And lastly, if the spell was cast after the damage received, then it's the players choice as to the effect.

(But then again I have been wrong before)

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

the key word here is "critical"

Every critical does a specific amount of damage. Usually in multiple effects as you called it. If none of the damage from a given critical exceeds the definition for a Light Critical, then the spell can allow ALL damage from that critical to be ignored.

Even if the spell is cast after damage has been received, it is the damage from 1 critical that is ignored, NOT  "ignore xx of total damage".

The purpose of the spell is to resist damage from specific criticals, not overall damage. Just keep that in mind. 

[Pat]

# The first one?

If it's only the first one, why then an improve duration scaling option?

Why an improve duration scaling option? Well you'd need at least 13 ranks to cast the spell so the minimum duration would be (13x10 rounds = 130 rounds) While this is a long time in combat terms it's really only 4 minutes 20 seconds. This could be very useful if you're looking for the cleric to heal you while blood pours from your body or if you've run out of power points and need to use the healing skill on yourself before you bleed out.

A final example I can think of would be if a character is swimming and something takes a bite out of him causing maneuver penalties. It would be useful if the penalties could be ignored while you swim across the river and, in this situation, the longer the spell lasts, the better.

[Pat]

Ok I'm not sure I totally understand so I'll break this down into the areas I'm note sure of.

the key word here is "critical"

Every critical does a specific amount of damage. Usually in multiple effects as you called it. If none of the damage from a given critical exceeds the definition for a Light Critical, then the spell can allow ALL damage from that critical to be ignored.

When I read the spell I thought of it in terms of damage (especially with the spell called Resist Damage) with the description of "light critical" being the spells limitations not the full effect.

Reading above it sounds like you mean that you would rule that the player ignores the first damage taken from an attack. So if the damage was 10 hits, 2 bleed and -10 modifier then all this damage would be resisted but that would be the end of the spell.  (I may have read this wrong since I could imagine players feeling upset if they cast a 7 pp spell and the damage received was something like 2 hits but you've Resisted it for 35 rounds. End of spell.)

Even if the spell is cast after damage has been received, it is the damage from 1 critical that is ignored, NOT  "ignore xx of total damage".

The purpose of the spell is to resist damage from specific criticals, not overall damage. Just keep that in mind. 

The spell says that "A Light Critical is descibed in Chapter 9 Healing Injury and Death." This, to me, sounded like a portion of damage:
1) up to -25 modifier
2) Up to 5 bleeds
3) Up to 25% of hits

and not the effects of one blow taken. This also leads to:

If the foe hit you with a weapon that does a slash and cold critical are both criticals resisted?
If the criticals totalled together are greater than a "Light" critical will the spell not work?
Or can you choose the Resist Damage spell to resist the cold damage but not the slash?

And lastly, if a player went into battle with an improved resistance say "Medium critical" would this then activate if anything up to a medium critical was taken or would it only activate if a critical in excess of a Light but less than a Medium?

If it's the first option then you could have the same problem as last time. The player takes 2 hits of damage and loses a 11 pp spell so that the 2 hits damage won't be felt for 55 rounds.

If it's option 2, what happens if you take multiple "Light" criticals but no mediums? You end up dying the death of a thousand cuts while your spell does nothing.

Any clarification would be appreciated 

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

Pat, I am the one who wrote the spell, so I know full well what the intentions of the spell were, even if I did not explain them clearly in the book. 

The intention is to allow a character to resist ALL of the damage from a single critical which is classed as a Light Critical.  Using the damage severity descriptions in Chapter 9, a Light Critical is one whose damage does not exceed any of the Light Damage criteria.

For example, a critical cannot cause more than 25% of the character's hits, it cannot cause bleeding of more than 5 points per round, and it cannot impose more than a -25 modifier. If the crit exceeds any of those criteria, it is no longer a Light Critical.

[jasonbrisbane]

Hi,

The spell description sounds ok to me.

Pat, you are right in that it affects one attack.
If someone were to take a 80 cold slash then the first critical rolled would be "resisted" (effects held for the spells duration) and the second critical would still be effected. (Of course you could always ask the GM to check the cold crit first, or the slash, if you wanted... )
If you wanted it to affect BOTH the cold Crit and the Slash Crit, then you would need Two castings to affect Both Criticals.
(Yes, even though they are from the same wound - that is why magical weapons or Warrior mages spells cast on weapons are so deadly and prized!)
BUT, if one attack was " -30 bleed at 2/rnd", then you cant affect this spell - the -30 makes it a medium critical wound and thus the entire wound cant be affected.

Sorry, the type of critical the player inflicts is irrespective of the damage that they CAN inflict.


For this spell I believe (Note: I dont have any books with me...) that there are two options: You cast the spell and you can affect the first light critical you receive from affecting you. You could also wait to get hit (ie -25), then try to cast the spell with the -25 penalty and hope you have enough bonuses and high enough roll to pull it off. Then you can pick which wound to Resist....

Rasyr, perhaps you can help (since I dont have any books near...)...
How long does it take to use the Healing skill on someone? is this given in the HARP core book? I cant remember... 
If it is a couple of minutes (which I would suspect ie in order to get bandages, unwrap them, clear/clean the wound (including compressing the skin, etc), put the bandages on ("healing would stop here but the healer still spends a few rounds puttign the excess bandages away again) then  is there a mechanism by which we know how long it takes? ie light wounds take Z minutes, medium Wounds take 2 x Z minutes, Critical Wounds take 4x Z minutes?

Thanks in advance.


For the length of the duration - if you were bleeding and not near a cleric you could extend the duration and ride for help to the nearest town, back up the dungeon to help, etc... You could probably do the same thing with Minor Healing (healing bleeding as you keep bleeding out but then you have to stop, recast, mount up and ride away.... And you might not have a lot of PP's so this would be bad to rely on.... <evil grin>

The # of rounds for the resist now become very important if you need the light wound negated whilst you use the Healing skill on the wound (ie yourself or on other people) otherwise the penalty will affect your healing skill roll...

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

Healing -- depends on action taken...

Taking an herb from the herbal bandoleer = 1 round

quick and dirty first aid -- a couple of rounds at most

proper first aid - you are talking on the order of minutes...

[jasonbrisbane]

Thanks Rasyr! 

[choc]

So up to your posts:

A light critical described as "This is any injury or combination of injuries where the character has taken less than 50%*** of his total number of hits in damage, has a Maneuver Penalty of -25 or less, or is bleeding at a rate of no more than 3 hits per round. " (H&S)

You can use 'resist damage' (class spell) with 7PP or you can use 'minor healing' 7PP (universal spell)

But:
normally a light critical covers a D for example - puncture & heat in combination - 5H 1B -5MM + 1B -5MM + 8H concussion on medium puncture.
option 1: minor healing 7PP heals for 13H 2B -10MM
option 2: resist damage 7PP resist the FIRST critical for a couple of rounds remain 8H 1B -5MM (concussion hits + additional heat critical)

conclusion: minor healing is the mightier spell (or doesn't minor healing heal heat criticals? then 1B -5MM remains - even though 8H less than resist damage spell - ok, if MH doesn't heal heat criticals you can use RD for the heat critical until you meet a cleric or a herb)


[*** shouldn't it written 25% of his total hits?]
 

[Pat]

Pat, I am the one who wrote the spell, so I know full well what the intentions of the spell were, even if I did not explain them clearly in the book. 

Apologies Rasyr...I should know better than to argue with the writer 

Can I check though....So if a Resist Damage spell is cast prior to combat then the first damage taken (provided it falls within the Light Damage limits) would be resisted?

So, as with my previous example, if I took 2 hits damage in the first round that is what would be resisted?

A light critical described as "This is any injury or combination of injuries where the character has taken less than 50%*** of his total number of hits in damage, has a Maneuver Penalty of -25 or less, or is bleeding at a rate of no more than 3 hits per round. " (H&S)

I'm not sure about Hack and Slash, I personally use the description in HARP core book Page 80 Injury, Healing and Death.

You can use 'resist damage' (class spell) with 7PP or you can use 'minor healing' 7PP (universal spell)

I don't know if Minor Healing costs more in H&S but in the core book it's only 3pp but it can only heal one of 3 options (25% of Hits, Bleeding up to 5 points or reduce maneauver penalties by 20)

But:
normally a light critical covers a D for example - puncture & heat in combination - 5H 1B -5MM + 1B -5MM + 8H concussion on medium puncture.
option 1: minor healing 7PP heals for 13H 2B -10MM
option 2: resist damage 7PP resist the FIRST critical for a couple of rounds remain 8H 1B -5MM (concussion hits + additional heat critical)

I guess the big difference would be that a Resist Damage spell would temporarily suspend all effects of 1 attack. (Hits, bleed and maneuver penalties) while a Minor Healing spell would heal the effects of 1 of the aspects of an attack (Minor heal could heal either 25% of hits or up to 5 bleed or -20 to maneuver penalties) but would need to be cast 3 times to heal all effects. (So 9 pp to heal 3 damage categories.)

In regards to which is more powerful, I guess it depends on your situation. Does your character have time to cast 3 minor healing spells? Is he under attack and therefore can't parry or attack for 3 rounds compared to 1 round for Resist Damage?

Anyway....More food for thought.

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

choc -- you are correct, Hack & Slash should say 25% as the core book does, not 50%.

Can I check though....So if a Resist Damage spell is cast prior to combat then the first damage taken (provided it falls within the Light Damage limits) would be resisted?

Yes, if cast early, I would allow it to affect the first critical within the Light range that effects the character. (i.e. the crit becomes the trigger, so to speak).

If cast after having been damaged, then the character must select which wound it effects (if there is a multiple choice). 

[choc]

@Rasyr: thx for clarification of this typo

while a Minor Healing spell would heal the effects of 1 of the aspects of an attack (Minor heal could heal either 25% of hits or up to 5 bleed or -20 to maneuver penalties) but would need to be cast 3 times to heal all effects. (So 9 pp to heal 3 damage categories.)

In regards to which is more powerful, I guess it depends on your situation. Does your character have time to cast 3 minor healing spells? Is he under attack and therefore can't parry or attack for 3 rounds compared to 1 round for Resist Damage?

Anyway....More food for thought.

Core Book p113
Minor Healing 3PP
Increase Healing (may heal all 3 options at once) +4 PP
in all a 7PP spell with a -30 modifier to the role if cast in one round. Normally you'll have about 12 ranks in minor healing.

[Pat]

Ahhhhhh I see what you mean