Topic: Vehioicle Construction: Mass & Volume changes

[NanoEther]

Many have noted how difficult it is to design a vehicle and it is the intention of this thread to try to solve this issue.
I would have liked to start from step 1 and progress through, but some sections are easier to tackle then others.
One thing to remember about the volume & mass in the SM construction rules is that most steps include access ways, work space, and hallways. To me this where the problem comes in, so the values presented here should be the minimal needed for that structure.

[NanoEther]

25. Crew Quarters
Volume
(# of living crew members) X 4
Mass
(# of living crew members) X 0.6

Option:
Hot Racking
Two crew members share a rack (bed), while one is working the other is sleeping. this does occasionally lead to issues.
Multiple Volume & Mass by .4

Explanation:
Crew Quarters on a modern Navy (surface) vessel can be thought of as a 6-rack cube. You have a 1 meter wide, 2 meter long access-way and on either side is a stack of racks 3 high. Each rack is a 1x1x2 cube. This turns into a 2x3x3 cube for 6 (18 units), dividing it down (18/6) leaves 3 units per person. I added 1 unit for a locker, combined communal area, and other systems (ventilation, power buss, etc). Reversing the mass to volume formula gives a mass of 1.11. Since most of the mass comes from accessory systems associated with the space and not the actual accommodations, I reduced the mass to 0.6 per person.
Compared to the original, this is a savings of 5m³, and 2.4mT per crew member.
But you'll have to remember to start providing any leftover space to hallways.

Non-living crew members
This area is only for living crew members, but what about robots & androids? Robots are simple automatons, as long as there is a workshop on board there shouldn't be a problem. If you want to make sure you have enough room, Multiply the workshop volume by 0.1, it should be less then the number of robots times 0.2 (or close). This can vary based on a large number of factors and to some extent applies to androids as well.
Androids have at least rudimentary SIs with true AIs appearing at higher tech levels. So, in addition to the maintenance requirements, one should consider crew interaction. This increases as the capabilities of the androids AI increases. I would start adding 1 unit of volume and a half unit of mass per android to crew quarters to encourage interaction.
If you treat your androids like dumb machines, eventually they'll come to the conclusion that they can run the ship more efficiently without the living crew members. (adventure hook anyone?)

[NanoEther]

26 Passenger Accommodations:

Economy Seating:
Volume
seats X .8
Mass
seats x .02

Standard Seating
Volume
seats x 1
Mass
seats x .03

Business Seating
volume
seats x 1.5
Mass
seats x.05

Luxury Seating
Volume
seats x 2
Mass
seats x .075

Cryogenic Berths:
Volume:
1.5 + (TLF) [multiple missile size at given TL by 0.5]
Mass
divide Volume by 3

Military/Low Staterooms
Volume
staterooms X 6.75
Mass
staterooms x 1

Standard Staterooms
Volume
staterooms x 13.5
Mass
staterooms x 2

First Class Staterooms
Volume
staterooms x 27
Mass
staterooms x 3

Explanations:
Seating was found to be way off, current airline space between the back leg of one seat to the back leg of the next seat is between .75 and .9 meters and weights of the seats them self are under 0.01 mt (10kg). The mass/volume includes enough space for 4 seats to have an aisle between them (2 to a side), and extra mass for storage etc.. I also expanded the seating options.

Unlike seating and berthing which changes little from TL to TL, cryo berths depend on TL, most of the mass and volume is for the support equipment, with a little extra for access (assumed a rank of cryo berths would be arranged facing another rank)

All staterooms are based off of a 3x3 space, the only variable is the number of occupants in that space. Mil/low have 3, standard have 2, and first class have 1. This is based off of current US military standards and is based on human needs, so it can vary by cultural and racial needs. I would suggest adding a multiplier based on what race the vehicle was designed for [or the largest multiplier for commercial vessels like cruise ships].

This Provides the following savings:
Volume:
Luxury Seating: 1; Low/Mil: .25; Standard: 16.5; First Class: 13
Mass:
Luxury Seating: 0.25; Low/Mil: 6; Standard: 6, First Class: 6
Cryo berths vary by tech level but you can save 1 unit of volume per unit easily.

[Dang it, just realized I should have double checked the title before making the first post]

[NanoEther]

25b Crew Quarters: Cafeteria & Food Service
volume
(living crew) x 4
Mass
(living crew) x 1.5

This includes the galley and seating, in general, a quarter is the galley with the rest being seating. This facility provides hot fresh food. The size assumes that half the crew can cycle through the galley and eat in a 2 to 3 hour period.

Options:
Automated
The Galley is automated, reducing not only the crew requirements but the size of the galley. Multiply the volume by 0.8 and the mass by 0.9

Ready Packs:
This is equivalent to microwave dinners and reduces the galley size considerably, however, this can affect crew moral. Multiply the volume and mass by 0.7.

Note:
Crew Quarters already have room set aside for toilets & showers (present habitation standard is 1 toilet, sink, & shower per 8 crew)

This does get closer to the formula that SM used, but it should have mentioned in the description what was considered part of crew quarters.

[NanoEther]

26b Passenger Food Service
This is for officers & paying guests and provides a larger facility with greater comfort. The options from 25b may be applied. Only calculate for passengers that will be on board for longer then 6 hours. The size assumes that more then half the passengers make use of the food service area during a 2 hour period.
Volume
passengers x 6
Mass
passengers x 2

Galley only
This is for vehicles that only have seating (or for areas of the vessel that are for seated passengers). Again, only necessary for vehicles that will have seated passengers for longer then 6 hours. Food is Ready Packs.
Volume
0.7
Mass
0.7

This does not include storage for meals.

[markc]

Yes good job. You can also have extra room for entertainment, exercise, reading, alien life form requirements, size adjusted "rooms and equipment" for non standard height and weight species, etc.
MDC

[NanoEther]

Entertainment & exercise I would put under Recreational Facilities, and I will note that even military ships need some sort of rec facility if it's going to spend longer then a couple days away from a station or planet (or port for marine vessels). Some of the facilities are just re-purposing other areas, the mess decks on military ships are often used in between meals for reading, playing table top games, etc.

Culture can be a major issue in ship design, consider that the US Navy is the only Navy that doesn't have bars on board their ships.

[Ynglaur]

Culture can be a major issue in ship design, consider that the US Navy is the only Navy that doesn't have bars on board their ships.

So that's why Marines are always so angry...

[NanoEther]

3. Select Hull
(Revised, removed double hulls as CATs)

CAT	Material	TL	Volume Factor	Cost Mult.
XI	Steel	12	.02	1.0
XII	Reinforced Steel	14	.03	1.5
XIII	Titanium	15	.02	1.5
XIV	Reinforced Titanium	15	.03	2
XV	Crysteel	17	.02	3.0
XVI	Reinforced Crysteel	17	.03	4.5
XVII	Fullerene	19	.01	8.5
XVIII	Reinforced Fullerene	19	.015	15
XIX	Collosium	24	.04	50
XX	Neutronium	29	0.001	200

Multiple Internal Hulls
(before superior alloys)
Internal hulls are used to prevent damage to internal spaces. This prevented loss of cargo, sinking, and other calamities. Each hull provides a +10DB at the cost of volume & mass.
NOTE: Internal hulls provide reinforcement equivalent to the Mass Hull Factor.

Number	DB	Volume/Cost	Mass/Reinforce
0	+0	1	1
1	+10	2.2	1.9
2	+20	3.3	2.8
3	+30	4.4	3.7

Number = Number of Internal Hulls
DB= Defensive Bonus
Volume/Cost = Volume & Cost Hull Factors
Mass/Reinforcement = Mass & Reinforcement Hull Factors

Hull Volume
(Vol. of vehicle) x (Vol. Factor) x (Hull Factor)
Hull Mass
(Vol. of vehicle) x 0.05 x (Hull Factor)
Hull Cost
Mass x 100 x (total cost multipliers)

Options:
Partial Internal Hulls
Marine vehicles that are intended to operate on the surface are more concerned with damage below the waterline. A vessel like this only has internal hulls slightly above their waterlines. Divide the Hull Factors by 2. DB only applies to attacks against the area with internal hulls.

Filled Voids
The area between the hulls is called a void, but it can be filled with various substances to reduce damage further. However, filled voids increase cost and time to maintain or repair the hulls. A void can only filled with one substance. (Modern marine military vessels use easily accessible voids as additional stowage, and fill none of the voids as this would affect buoyancy). Add .2 to Mass Hull Factor and Cost Hull Factor for each layer of voids filled, this does not affect Reinforcement Hull Factor or Volume Hull Factor.
Ballistic: +10 vs. Ballistic (Piercing) weapons
Explosive: +10 vs. Explosive (Blast & shrapnel causing) weapons)
Thermal: +10 vs. Laser & Blaster weapons
GM Option: This bonus can also be applied as a negative vs. the applicable critical.
NOTE:
If multiple substances are used, either by using different substances in different voids (checker boarding the voids)or by mixing, divide the bonus given by the number of substances. If there are more then one internal hulls, then each layer of voids can have different fills and retain the full bonuses.

Superior Alloys
Change Table to add Reinforcement Factor. Reinforcement Factor is half of Cost Multiplier

Reinforcement
(Replace second paragraph)
The reinforcements necessary depend a great deal on the CAT of the hull and any hull improvements. Existing hull improvements from superior alloys and internal hulls will reduce the amount of reinforcement necessary. To determine how much reinforcement the vessel needs, Use the vehicles Mass and CAT number to find Reinforcement percentage. Multiply this by the number of Gs and subtract the Superior Alloy Reinforcement Factor and the Internal Hull Mass Factor. If the result is 0 or negative, you do not have to add reinforcement. If it is positive, multiply the Volume of the ship by this value to find the volume of the reinforcement, then do the same with the mass to find the mass of the reinforcement.
Reinforcement
(Reinforcement for Acc.) x Gs – (Sup. Alloy RF) –(Int. Hull Mass Factor)
Mass of Reinforcement
(Vehicle Mass) x Reinforcement
Volume of Reinforcement
(Vehicle Volume) x Reinforcement
Cost of Reinforcement
Reinforcement x Mass x 100

[NanoEther]

You may also want to use some ideas from this topic:
http://www.ironcrown.com/ICEforums/index.php?topic=11040.0

Names of materials from CAT XV and up can be changed to whatever fits your setting.

[NanoEther]

Reviewing material from another contributor, once I'm done reviewing I'll continue with this thread.

[VladD]

Some good work NanoEther. I always liked the SM2 vehicle construction and I always knew it was kinda off on some points, although the specifics elude me after not having read them for so long.

A well deserved Idea point!

[JimiSue]

There were some items in the SM2 construction that were absolutely massive - An often-voiced complaint was that the rules forced your design to such an extent that variety was difficult until you got to the massive city-sized ships. Sensors stand out in my memory as something that seemed unnecessarily large. I got around this by three mechanisms:

1) adjusting the volume formulas so you actually had room for additional things like redundant systems, workshops, shuttle bays and the like
2) allowing smaller, more expensive units to be available where tech allowed
3) having some provinces within the empire (or more interestingly, some free planets) be known for their expertise in designing laser cannons, or shiled technology, or sublight drives, and so on - so if the PCs could get there, and had the money, they could upgrade sections of their ship to make it more tardis-like.

This opened the door to things like smuggling ships - where some of the systems were surprisingly sophisticated... leaving more room for subterfuge cargo.

It's easy to get bogged down in the detail of this kind of thing. I find the most useful rule to remember is the one that says that the rules are a guideline - as soon as they start to hinder play, drop them, or change them.