Topic: The power of the "00"

[providence13]

Last night, 7 players and me as GM and I think there were 2 "00" rolls.

In all fairness there were ~8 open ended really high rolls that had awesome results.

Results from Power Perception: "You can see tendrils of Essence energy/flows.. The spell is known and able to be cast" from detecting someone who was invisible. Now, without even having the List, our (Darn) Mage, can cast Unseen III; but nothing else on the List.

Another Character rolled "00" for init. Now, this wasn't technically a "00" because we roll "2D10 +...." but that is pretty rare, for us. We were talking about just "giving" them init when that happens; but I'm sure they don't want it to happen to the bad guys.

IIRC, The other was a 9 round prep Lightning Bolt that took out the evil leader priest type;  it took far longer for the humble GM to write him up.

As soon as the Cleric stepped in the old mine.. he rolled a "00" on his Caving roll. This was a few games back (they've been in that mine for a while now), but it keeps coming up as long as he's in it. "I think the passage is safest... THIS way!"

I know every situation is different, but there is a bit of play in the "00" chart results for different skills. Some people give an xp award, I was thinking of a free Rank in the skill.

Does anyone have any clever house rules for "00's"? They get to wear the pointy hat for the evening..?

[RandalThor]

For the Perception/Spell I would allow them to have the ability to cast the spell up until they slept - it is in their "active memory" only. After I would say they have to only purchase the spells prior to the Unseen III to learn it (the Unseen III would be free, but they have to purchase the others to get to it - the very next time they level, not after that).

As for the Initiative I would say they could go in the Snap action phase without the negative modifier for that round only.

The Lightining Bolt/Leader Killer is the game - I cannot tell you how many times that I have spent hours on something for the players to not even engage it or to brush right by it in moments. And not just in RM.

As for the Caving roll, I would give them a bonus to future Caving checks not apply the "00" to each that would come up in that cave system. Caves change as you go through them, sometimes dramatically.


Give them a discount, not a free rank - or a free rank only if they purchase one or more ranks. That's my take.

[providence13]

Hey RandalThor, Thanks for the feedback.

With the Power Awareness "00" :
1. View and track magic energies (currents) for 5 rnds
2. +15 to all spell casting attempts
3. Attune to any object you can touch for 1 rnd and concentrate
4. ID forms of magic (qv Power Perception)
5. The spell, if any, is known and usable.

It's the last bit that made me say "huh"? I've heard it before, but thinking of it in a RMFRP context, that's not how the system normally works. I see where you're coming from. Known means that you could ID the spell. Usable means just that, able to be cast, Spell stored or Glyph/Rune (as I take it), but I never thought that it would be a temporary thing. Although it could be inferred that all the above effects last for 5 rnds. I like your way of doing it, but I already told him he knows that specific spell on the List..

Looking at the Outdoor Enviro Table, it must have been a 176. (I don't remember a hermit ) "Any activities in this Category, gain +30 for 6 months". I only gave it to him while in the cave, but that was a big enough bonus to considerably help the party.

With the Lightning Bolt, SM to 10' Radius, I was just whining.

[RandalThor]

You could still force him to learn the level 1 & 2 spells on list next level, he just has that one for free. (And free is a great price.)

I though you said you were applying the "00" to the future caving checks..  A +30 is very nice, very nice indeed.

[providence13]

You could still force him to learn the level 1 & 2 spells on list next level, he just has that one for free. (And free is a great price.)

That is a good way of looking at it.. How do I word it so it doesn't sound so forced?

Players do hate to be forced.

"Well, you did get spell slot #10 but you don't have 10 Ranks in the List." hhmmm.?

The easy part is that the spell's affects are pretty set in stone. 3 targets/24 hours/10' range

[Temujin]

Keep in mind Power Awareness has skills like Attunement and Read Runes.  I think it is with those skills in mind that a line like "The spell, if any, is known and useable" should be understood.  After all, I doubt it would apply to a Divination check.  You can always apply it to a Power Perception check, it is after all an extraordinary result, but I would suggest in such a case allowing the spell to be manipulated only while Power Perception is active, not forever learned as a spell rank.

[providence13]

Good point Temujin, but in RM spells aren't forgotten, as in lesser systems. This, to me, kinda implies what it says..  not that I'm thrilled with it.

Now, it could be argued that "chart text" is the final word on how something plays out. That would be a fair assessment, across the board, totally removing GM bias.
Some rolls for crits are "still have half a round to act", or something. Here is a precedent for going around the rules; melee requires 60%Act min, IIRC.
So to say "known and usable"... that is pretty clear..
But, maybe I'm way too nice.

I really appreciate everyone's feedback. My expertise with RM rule arbitration is limited.

[pastaav]

I do agree about the wording being about attunament and not power perception. For instance we can note that it refers to a single spell and not the many spells that Power Perception could see.

One way to analyze this is to consider what the meaning would be if we cut the middle part
"The spell, if any, is known and useable"
would instead be
"The spell is known and useable"
In some sense this creates a logical problem since there might not be a spell present...but on another level you could argue that this phrasing would work just as great. What player would argue that they learned something out of nothing?

I find it more plausible that the provision "if any" is intended to mean "if the skill is used in a context when I am trying to use a spell" than it is meant to redundantly specify that there must be a spell present for you to find something.

We can also note that all succesful entries of the maneuver has the same text, if a simple 111 is enough to reach the effect then it can't be something as good as "you learnt a spell for free"

[yammahoper]

OTOH such learning of spells could expalin the origin of races with inherient spell knowledge, assume the ability is passed down through blood lines.

[providence13]

you know, I was thinking something similar, yammahoper.

Maybe this is how some Amateur Mages get their start.

[Right Wing Wacko]

Sounds a lot like the sorcerer in the Pathfinder RPG...

Powers are derived from some kind of "entity" in the characters bloodline...

[providence13]

Powers are derived from some kind of "entity" in the characters bloodline...


Reminds me of an Anne Rice novel..

[Fornitus]

all hail Lasher!

[providence13]

The Power of the "66"!!

OK, last night there were a couple "00"s; again! (I've got to check those dice)

But the real kicker were those darn "66"s!
Basically, "enemy struck through jugular, bleeding 6/round, down and dies in 6 rounds".
This particular critter was a demon that regen 3/rnd.
Next rnd, the party was incredulously surprised that the demon, still with a 6 bleeder and still going to die in 5 rounds... kept fighting until he died in 5 rnds!

I'm thinking, regen supernatural creature, crit doesn't say "down and out" or dies instantly...

Was this unfair on my part for the power of the "66"?

[markc]

  IMO it is the call of the GM as to what the creature does. Also the creatures does not know he will die in 6 rounds unless he has some ability that gives him real time body info, ie hits and crits info.
MDC   

[Right Wing Wacko]

  IMO it is the call of the GM as to what the creature does. Also the creatures does not know he will die in 6 rounds unless he has some ability that gives him real time body info, ie hits and crits info.
MDC

Yep!

[providence13]

Also the creatures does not know he will die in 6 rounds...

Thanks, guys. That's pretty much what I was thinking; although I appreciate the validation.

[markc]

Also the creatures does not know he will die in 6 rounds...

Thanks, guys. That's pretty much what I was thinking; although I appreciate the validation.

 Yes I try and play each creature as I think they would acct naturally in what ever situation is at hand. Which is not easy and has taken a while to learn to do.
MDC

[yammahoper]

An interesting talent I allowed once was "Superior Constitution."  Any instant death crits kill target in 1/2 its Co mod.  Any crits stating X rnds till death become Co mod in rnds till death. 

PC had a +12 Co mod.

[providence13]

yammahoper, I'll bet that was a fun campaign to play in, but I don't want to give my players that much power. If I use it, then they can too.

However, if a crit says "down (not down and out) and dies in X rnds", I'll allow them to get back up (paying the rise from prone %Act) and fight.

I really don't want to tell them how many rnds they have before death.. but I also don't want to work every single book. They are pretty good about the differences between player/character knowledge.