Author Topic: Guild Companion May 2016 (Issue 207)  (Read 2877 times)

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Offline Kristen Mork

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Guild Companion May 2016 (Issue 207)
« on: May 03, 2016, 02:35:10 PM »
Greetings from the Guild Companion; Issue 207 is available at www.guildcompanion.com. This month have an exploration of Pantheism in Practice (Local Gods in a Fantasy World) by Bradley White. Our preview for HARP looks at travel to, within and from the Abyss.

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Offline jdale

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Re: Guild Companion May 2016 (Issue 207)
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2016, 07:33:47 PM »
I enjoyed the local gods discussion. I would be inclined to allow a follower of a local god to gain powers in other places by speaking to similar gods in other locations. For example, a follower of Amnur could make offerings and entreaties to water gods in other rivers, streams, and lakes asking for their aid. Depending on the nature of the local god, they might be required to make specific types of offerings, and might need to seek out lore or other priests to learn the desires and wishes of those local gods. There might be some other river gods which are already allies of Amnur, and more prone to aid Amnur's servants, while there might be others who have rivalries (e.g. two rivers which feed into the same lake or sound might be rivals for the affections of a lake or coastal god) and who are much less likely to give each other a hand. In an area that is particularly dark or corrupted, the local river god might be angry and malevolent, or sorrowful, or unpredictably moody, creating extra trouble. (That first level spell for sensing a river's mood could be useful in such cases, I would probably allow that to work everywhere.) So, rather than making such followers unplayable for PCs, it might create a lot of interesting subplots and intrigues, and make the landscape feel a little bit more alive. If you extend the reach of each god sufficiently (e.g. a river god's domain extends to the boundaries of the river's watershed), they might never be completely out of magic.
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Offline rdanhenry

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Re: Guild Companion May 2016 (Issue 207)
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2016, 08:30:39 PM »
That's not pantheism. Pantheism is basically "God = the Universe", which normally leads to a quite abstract and non-anthropomorphized concept of God. It is not the same thing as polytheism, nor is it the same thing as animism (the belief that all or most natural things have spirits), which "The presumption is that in a spiritual world, such phenomena as mountains, lakes, forests, cities, oceans — even smaller rivers and streams, or particularly venerable trees — become so invested with spiritual force across time that they develop a certain level of agency, even, in some cases, developing personalities that can interact with other beings" may be aiming at.
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Offline MrApollinax

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Re: Guild Companion May 2016 (Issue 207)
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2016, 09:05:25 PM »
That's not pantheism. Pantheism is basically "God = the Universe", which normally leads to a quite abstract and non-anthropomorphized concept of God. It is not the same thing as polytheism, nor is it the same thing as animism (the belief that all or most natural things have spirits), which "The presumption is that in a spiritual world, such phenomena as mountains, lakes, forests, cities, oceans — even smaller rivers and streams, or particularly venerable trees — become so invested with spiritual force across time that they develop a certain level of agency, even, in some cases, developing personalities that can interact with other beings" may be aiming at.

Boy, that sure did get me thinking... Technically, I'd say it might even be a bit closer to panpsychism (the Thales quote might recommend that reading) with elements of animism. 'Pantheism' in a non-technical sense can also mean an indifferent acceptance and tolerance of multiple deities/spiritual forces. That's the way in which I intended the word to be taken, rather than in (for example) a Spinozist manner.

But I don't think that the idea of pantheism (i.e. universe is coterminous with or equivalent to God) is logically inconsistent with the content of the article, which I suppose could be taken to include the concept that as all things=God, all things represent some perceived aspect of God and may be approached as such. The fact that such powers wane further from their source doesn't necessarily preclude that reading, as it is the way that the individual's faith is constructed that dictates what they can do. But I grant you, that's a bit forced!



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Offline MrApollinax

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Re: Guild Companion May 2016 (Issue 207)
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2016, 09:19:36 PM »
@ jdale

Dang, I wish I'd thought of some of that myself! In the campaign from which Amnur is drawn, there's a hierarchy of gods and also some 'powers' that exist outside of that hierarchy: most minor river and mountain gods are vassals of Avraki, the Lord of Mountains and Rivers, so there's potentially a mechanism right there for being able to petition for power in different locales.
There's also a bunch of deities called the Wilder Gods, who express the raw side of their divine portfolios: some local gods similar to Amnur draw water from that well instead. They'd be less amenable to suasion and would require some heavy duty rites to grant power to a Priest of Amnur.

Glad you enjoyed the article, and thanks for giving me lots to chew over. I'll certainly be adopting the idea about River's Mood being available anywhere.
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Offline jdale

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Re: Guild Companion May 2016 (Issue 207)
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2016, 11:31:45 PM »
It's only fair -- while the cosmology doesn't suit my setting at all, I am very likely to use your spell list! I do have a river-based religion and especially like the immersion spells.
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