Topic: Swarms

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

Did anyone ever create rules to handle swarms? I made many but never really were satisfied with any... It's especially upsetting since most creatures that would be summoned in swarms are level 0, making it impossible to determine how many are conjured by a mere Summon I spell, therefore from any Summon N spell…
If anyone wonders, yes, I have a rule version inspired from that game system, that handles swarms.

[jdale]

Have not tried this out but my current thinking is treating it as a single creature with a level:

AT 5, DB 20, 10 hits/level, initiative +5, immune to Puncture and Slash criticals as well as Bleeding, base move of 25 (flying), Perception +2/level. Can only carry out actions other than movement when massed, but can disperse, in which case it can take no more than 2 hits per attack unless the attack covers the entire area. When dispersed, the swarm has Stalk/Hide skill of +80 and maintains its normal movement rate (pace modifiers still apply to Stalk/Hide). Dispersing or massing takes one round.

This is RMU but aside from the AT should work out about the same. I would think non-flying swarms would disperse and mass more slowly. Swarms of larger creatures (e.g. rats) could take more damage per attack when dispersed.

[RandalThor]

In many ways I think it is best to think of a swarm more as an area effect spell that persists than an entity, with special rules on how to disperse. While damage done by such a swarm is not likely to be high (and armor mostly useless), the overal nuisance factor whould be. Meaning that anyone caught in the area might not take a lot of damage each round (unless we are talking about poisonous insects, of course), but will be severly hampered in whatever they want to do. In fact, it may be so annoying that they can do nothing but try to escape the swarm, to the point of running away as fast as they can.

[Tommi]

I like swarms and have been using them increasingly. They pose tactically very different challenge to players than other monsters.

I personally have spend a lot time in semi arctic swamps in north and the nature of mosquito swarm is more area effect like (as Rand above commented).

As I wanted to challenge players with something different  I created undead mosquito swarm for my last session (last week). During late autumn or winter sound of flees/mosquitos should be/is peculiar. My players (lvl8-11) were inside a tower and thus fleeing was more challenging.

If enveloped one would get A-cold each round and roll RR vs co-drain (related to amount of undeadinsects).

Technically:
Drain attack was lvl 10*(percentage of the mosquitos active). (Really big swarm would have higher level)
Critical A if +75% of swarm intact, A-25  if 50-75% of the swarm intact and A-50 if 25-50% (Really big would give B-crits).
I use percentage as health status of this swarm.  Swarms speed was 30' (which is more than natural swarms speed but these are drawn to life). Basically any non fumble attack kills one but number of insects is in hundreds (200+ and thus meaningless) so area attacks and fleeing were the only solutions.
Ball attacks if you are in swarm and do not like to fry yourself would affect about 30-35% (less if you also avoid friends)... Fire kills permanently, cold ball affects but will not kill permanently (undead regeneration would work ). For repulsion: undead type is I and level is 1 (will flee = disperse  but will probably not be destroyed).

[Peter R]

How many insects would I need to kill to level up?

I assume I got x5 for the very first ant I killed as a child but I should still be getting x2 for single combat even if killing the ants is now routine. Those little red ants give a nasty bite so the action is not without risk.

I don't think I have ever done this since my AD&D days but now I would just make it up as I went along treating the swarm as a role playing encounter not a combat encounter.

[markc]

There is a spell from the RMSS Essence Companion, GuildCraft Mastery IIRC that allows for the caster to repel zero level creatures, IMHO the spell would work for a swarm. Why the swarm is composed of zero level creatures and it only gains levels (so to speak) when it is taken as a whole.
MDC

[Peter R]

Did anyone ever create rules to handle swarms? I made many but never really were satisfied with any... It's especially upsetting since most creatures that would be summoned in swarms are level 0, making it impossible to determine how many are conjured by a mere Summon I spell, therefore from any Summon N spell…
If anyone wonders, yes, I have a rule version inspired from that game system, that handles swarms.

What is your best solution so far?

You could just create a 1st level creature as a 'Swarm of ...' and then work out the stats for a swarm of any particular type. They then become summonable. You can then work out the special effects relating to the swarm as a whole.

If you can find the stats for a swarm in another system you could use the conversion rules in C&T (pg97 I believe) to create the RM swarm.

[OLF, i.e. Olf Le Fol]

What is your best solution so far?

Convert them from D&D 3.5.
My alternative was to use the creature stats in C&T, then create rule on how to get the stats of a rat swarm, for instance, from the stats of one rat, depending on how many rats there are. It's... not easy, because of the mere fact RM2 doesn't have a coherent standpoint when it comes to how creature stats are made, so making a set of rules that work for one kind of creatures/swarm (say, rats) may give weird result when applied to another (say, centipedes, wasps or carnivorous flying squirrels). Hence my post, obviously.

[Peter R]

I do not think you will get a single universal rule like that. A pack of rats behaves very differently from a swarm of bees and both are different to a mass migration of soldier ants.

In the next session I am running the players will be the in the path of a pack of rats in a very confined space. I have ruled that one in eight rats will attempt to bite the players. The rats just want to get past the players and flee the even greater threat further down the tunnel. The players will be able to strike at individuals and may kill a few but most of them will just stream past the players and away.

Soldier ants I would treat as a hazard where the players will suffer an 'A' tiny for each round they are in amoungst the ants and probably for 1-5 rounds after they get out of the ants path.

A swarm of bees I would probably do a single hit of damage per round and then I would look at bee sting poison to see how to apply that. Probably a -1% to activity for each round they are in the cloud.

I do not think a party could kill a march of soldier ants or a swarm of bees using melee weapons but a 'ball' type spell would probably take them all out if the player hit the swarm.

That is what I would/will do.

[Warl]

For insects, whether flying or ground bound, I would treat them as an area effect like others have said.

a swarm of larger creatures like Rats? I would probably go the same way as Peter R Perhaps giving a roll od 1d12-2 rats biting a character per round.
In a swarm situation such as the rats, DB isn't going to help as much as your "fighting" way to many opponents, to defend well against all.