Topic: Adventure Paths (a la Pathfinder)

[egdcltd]

Found a free one - don't know how good an example it is of Pathfinder though: http://paizo.com/products/btpy82r0?GameMastery-Module-D0-Hollows-Last-Hope

[Hurin]

Looks great! I especially like the color maps.

I would love to see a RM module of this sort, with italicized text for the DM to read and tips on tactical behavior for the monsters, all integrated into a ready-to-play adventure.

[Terry K. Amthor]

Found a free one - don't know how good an example it is of Pathfinder though: http://paizo.com/products/btpy82r0?GameMastery-Module-D0-Hollows-Last-Hope

Yes this is a good example. I can certainly do this if people find it helpful...

[Thom @ ICE]

Thanks for posting the link - (always like good quality free roleplaying material).
I changed the link to an active link so you can just click on it.

[Terry K. Amthor]

Thanks for posting the link - (always like good quality free roleplaying material).
I changed the link to an active link so you can just click on it.

Thanks Thom, yes it's an interesting little module. It does make me think that maybe my SW books can be a bit dense with material (fiber?) and could stand a little more 'flavor' (candy?) that is directly relevant to the adventures at hand. I certainly enjoy writing color (smell/touch/hear) text...

So, another cup of joe, and back to Gryphonburgh and maybe some spice to the Eidolon adventures.

[egdcltd]

Thanks for posting the link - (always like good quality free roleplaying material).
I changed the link to an active link so you can just click on it.

I wasn't entirely certain whether posting active links to other systems would be appreciated, so I didn't.

[Thom @ ICE]

In this case there's no problem with it - it's a free product and be highlighted for use as an example of something fans want for ICE products.  Linking to the Pathfinder system books themselves would not be acceptable - but thank you for your discretion.

[RandalThor]

8

Thanks Thom, yes it's an interesting little module. It does make me think that maybe my SW books can be a bit dense with material (fiber?) and could stand a little more 'flavor' (candy?) that is directly relevant to the adventures at hand. I certainly enjoy writing color (smell/touch/hear) text...

That is precisely the stuff I like to see in modules; excellent flavor text and awesome maps, both of which YOU are known for Terry.

*Engaging all the senses, I find, really helps sell the situation.

[BeggarKing (Thomas)]

If you are just looking for a sample I'd try a used bookstore, you can get older ones fairly cheaply. Amazon too of course can hook you up with used copies. Kingmaker, Rise of the Runelords are fairly popular.

Adventure path details from the source here: http://paizo.com/pathfinder/adventurePath

Its not just the format, cadence is part of their business model - they deliver these monthly (note - this team is the team that was outsourced to produce the dungeon/dragon magazines - they got so good at producing content they spun their own company + brand)

[Deepfire]

<snip> Nine (and counting) detailed campaigns that integrate with a larger world with its associated world-books.</snip>

When I count them in my game room correctly, there are 16 Paizo-Adventure Paths campaigns produced or in production right now. 3 in the old Dungeon magazines, one of these is shackled city which was reprinted as a one-volume-book. And 13 d&d/pathfinder adventure paths which all consists of 6 books each.

So: much more fun to play

[Thom @ ICE]

Actually, Pathfinder took the fanbase from WoTC (based upon their Dragon/Dungeon work) and used it to justify full time staff members who work on these projects.  They then spun off of WoTC's mistake of making additional revisions to D&D leaving a decent percentage of fans disgruntled, and more than happy to jump on the Pathfinder system.  They were in the right place at the right time and were able to capitalize on it.  ICE will not be able to duplicate that model as we are reliant upon freelancers to work on the projects and have a far smaller audience willing to subscribe to that model of product offering.  That doesn't mean we won't try to offer similar products - but expecting anything close to a monthly release cadence would only lead to disappointment.

[BeggarKing (Thomas)]

Sure. Not expecting ICE to copy this model - just pointing out how another group uses regular content releases (and other things) as a way to keep their fans engaged.  I do think that ShadowWorld is one of the most interesting fantasy settings ever and I'm looking forward to seeing more, regardless of delivery.

[Telwyn]

An interesting thread. Certainly I would like to see more premade Shadow World adventures - even if it's not directly applicable to my current campaign, it's easier to relocate a module within the setting than morph an adventure to a new setting (changing all location names, religions et al).

I agree with the advantage of canned text to read to players, I'm sure it would surpass anything I could improvise or prepare myself. I think the attraction of the adventure path model for me would be the ready-made campaign aspect - a set of adventures with a coherent story-arc. If that would be too ambitious then perhaps some space given to how separate adventures could be interwoven might be an alternative?

[Thom @ ICE]

That I think is potentially do-able.  (But I don't want to speak for Nicholas or Terry).
The monthly subscription model is not.

[yammahoper]

Adventures would be great.  Canned text I never cared for, but I can skip it easily enough (I have many, many times).

[LonePaladin]

One of the biggest draws of these Adventure Paths is that they give everything a GM needs to run a long-term campaign with little preparation on their part. They normally start with a beginning party, dealing with a straightforward low-level situation, and let things expand and escalate until the group is dealing with something large-scale, maybe even world-changing.

The original APs, "Shackled City", "Age of Worms", and "Savage Tide", were all twelve-part stories published in Dragon Magazine (while it was still bring printed). All of them gradually increased in scope, and included references to classic D&D material. For instance, a late adventure in the "Age of Worms" path required the party to fight an undead dragon first mentioned in the map for "White Plume Mountain", one of the first D&D adventures.

These campaigns were written to take a 1st-level party and take them all the way to 20th level or higher. (The D&D and Pathfinder rules have a soft 'cap' at that level, but include optional rules for going beyond that.)

A proper adventure path for SW would have to start with something simple, but gradually expand to include traveling halfway across the world, and maybe even a little plane-hopping (though I don't think anyone would willingly travel to the Pales). The end would have to involve a face-off with one of the many Ancient Evils, of which there is no shortage.

It would certainly be a daunting task to write one of these. But I must agree with the others -- I think this is something that had been missing from Rolemaster all these years, a long-term scenario that gives GMs everything they need in one package.

[Terry K. Amthor]

One of the biggest draws of these Adventure Paths is that they give everything a GM needs to run a long-term campaign with little preparation on their part. They normally start with a beginning party, dealing with a straightforward low-level situation, and let things expand and escalate until the group is dealing with something large-scale, maybe even world-changing.

The original APs, "Shackled City", "Age of Worms", and "Savage Tide", were all twelve-part stories published in Dragon Magazine (while it was still bring printed). All of them gradually increased in scope, and included references to classic D&D material. For instance, a late adventure in the "Age of Worms" path required the party to fight an undead dragon first mentioned in the map for "White Plume Mountain", one of the first D&D adventures.

These campaigns were written to take a 1st-level party and take them all the way to 20th level or higher. (The D&D and Pathfinder rules have a soft 'cap' at that level, but include optional rules for going beyond that.)

A proper adventure path for SW would have to start with something simple, but gradually expand to include traveling halfway across the world, and maybe even a little plane-hopping (though I don't think anyone would willingly travel to the Pales). The end would have to involve a face-off with one of the many Ancient Evils, of which there is no shortage.

It would certainly be a daunting task to write one of these. But I must agree with the others -- I think this is something that had been missing from Rolemaster all these years, a long-term scenario that gives GMs everything they need in one package.

And... that was pretty much what I intended for the Grand Campaign, along with having a sweeping narrative story, and exposing the characters to all of the unique aspects of the Shadow World along the way.

[Hurin]

Exactly!

Think how awesome it would be to describe the great locations and people of Kulthea for your players! We already often get great little snippets of Kulthean flavor in many of the regional sourcebooks, when Terry writes those little prose stories as adventure hooks and to set the scene. But the players rarely get to read those parts. So for an adventure path, you just have to make them suitable to read out to the players so that they too can set the scene in their minds:

'The great, floating city of Eidolon soars above you, shining in the Kulthean sun. Flying ships of every size and color hover about the spinning disc like bees around a hive. As your own ship pulls closer to one of the wharfs, an eruption of shouts draws your attention still higher. Mouths gape and fingers point to a winged speck in the distance... after decades of mysterious silence, the Dragonlord has appeared again!"

[Terry K. Amthor]

Exactly!

Think how awesome it would be to describe the great locations and people of Kulthea for your players! We already often get great little snippets of Kulthean flavor in many of the regional sourcebooks, when Terry writes those little prose stories as adventure hooks and to set the scene. But the players rarely get to read those parts. So for an adventure path, you just have to make them suitable to read out to the players so that they too can set the scene in their minds:

'The great, floating city of Eidolon soars above you, shining in the Kulthean sun. Flying ships of every size and color hover about the spinning disc like bees around a hive. As your own ship pulls closer to one of the wharfs, an eruption of shouts draws your attention still higher. Mouths gape and fingers point to a winged speck in the distance... after decades of mysterious silence, the Dragonlord has appeared again!"

Nice! Maybe you should write some! 

Re this little adventure side-track (4 days to finish), I am not doing a whole lot of 'GM read text,' just a few description passages at key points. With the adventures, I am trying to do several very low-level ones, and some higher ones (maybe the PCs start off from here, and return later, knowing a few locals and getting involved in bigger things?), and several very brief adventure hook ideas. I'm up to 15 adventure ideas, so I'm certainly not going to detail them all. And some are somewhat generic (with a SW twist) while others are very SW-centric (mostly centered around the bridge, and a few specific residents).

[justabloke]

So I reckon I need to apologise to Thom.  I meant no disrespect for all you all do.  I have nothing but admiration for you and all your hard work.  I know and understand that ICE and the ShadowWorld are more labours of love than they can ever be money-making deals.

But that said, now that others have chimed in, I would just like to add to idea.  While it seems clear from reading between the lines that resources aren't available to produce an entire Adventure Path (a la Pathfinder), perhaps the scope exists to create, over time, a series of adventures that all link together.  I completely except Thom's point about why a subscription model won't work. 

I to would like to put in a vote for the descriptive text used throughout Pazio's products, it really does add a huge amount of flavour. 

I also think there is money to be made in releasing the series over time, with just enough time between releases for the "average" group to play thru a module.  That way people can either play thru as it is released or pay for the whole bundle at the end.  However once again I concede that the resources (i.e. Terry's/others time) may not be available.

I also take Thom's point about stat/item conversion.  But to be honest Rolemaster isn't my reason for being here, the ShadowWorld is, I love it.  Terry just aced it IMHO.  So perhaps a series of adventures that maybe lead up to the "Legacy of the Sea Drake" (maybe with some flesh added to it) followed by a series that deals with happens afterwards and ties into situation around Ondoval...  Just an idea :-)

Regardless, please keep the SW material coming.