Official ICE Forums
Systems & Settings => Shadow World => Topic started by: Yseulte Harper on March 01, 2015, 06:46:22 PM
-
As a long-time Tolkien fan, who played and GMed in Middle Earth with RM2, I recognize the ME roots for most of the races/cultures in the Rolemaster Fantasy Role Playing System. I'm planning a campaign in Shadow World, since it offers a large canvas. I'm having trouble, though, fitting some of the races and cultures into the SW setting.
My particular challenge at the moment is where the southern empires that the Mariners are pining to recapture... I was trying to build a mixed man of the Mariner culture and wanted to know where to locate the empire of which they had been deprived by High Man betrayal (according to the Mariner viewpoint). My original GM made me a gift of several SW books, including the "Jaiman: Land of Twilight" module" and I was considering making them exiles from U-Lyshak. Would that work?
Also, is there anywhere more details on Gryphon College? I am beginning a very low-level campaign in Quellborne, with plans for the players to be porter/guards for a trade caravan though the mountain pass through the Caldsfang/Dragonfang mountains that define the southern border of Quellborne, into Saralis and Rhakhaan.
I guess after the years spent with MERP products (and using a world defined by Tolkien) I'm finding the Shadow World lacking in details.
From all I've read by the fans, I want to love Shadow World, but I need some help...
-
The SW Master Atlas(s) have SW specific raes and cultures in them.
There is also Raes and Cultures book that covers many SW races and monster races.
I believe there is a SW document in the Vault covering SW races for RMSS/RM2.
Enjoy and good luck,
-
There's a bit on Gryphon College in the fiction Loremaster Legacy.
-
Quellbourne is an excellent choice to start out a campaign ;-)
Get the first SW experience flowing and throw them a plot hook. Are you saving the Quellborne city ruins for a later date? I'm asking because I couldn't get my group to stay away from that place once they discovered it's existence. Sadly we haven't picked up after the last session which is a while back now. That place is a lot of fun.
-
Yes, I'm planning to save the city ruins for much later. My current plan calls for having them escort a merchant caravan south through the mountains into Saralis and Rhakhaan, to encounter some of the lowest power adventures included in "Jaiman: Land of Twilight."
They'll get to do adventuring in their home region after they gained a few levels.
-
My original GM made me a gift of several SW books, including the "Jaiman: Land of Twilight" module" and I was considering making them exiles from U-Lyshak. Would that work?
I don't think so, personally. It would help to know which books you do have to help narrow down your choices, but as others have said, the Master Atlas will be your best resource. To come up with some options / ideas for you, it would be helpful to know roughly how long ago your people lost your homeland. But, there are tons of lands they could come from. Instead of high men, it could be the Raven Queen of Gaalt and her armies that kicked them out of their lands.
Also, is there anywhere more details on Gryphon College?
The stuff in the Jamain book is all there is officially, but I edited the map (added another floor, as well as bathrooms - map makers always tend to shy away from building in bathrooms for some reason)
I guess after the years spent with MERP products (and using a world defined by Tolkien) I'm finding the Shadow World lacking in details.
Well, if you measure everything against Tolkien's work, it is 99% sure to come up lacking. ;D
-
Both Quellbourne and Gryphon College were founded in the exodus of the intellectuals from Zor so there is also that link between the two.
The campaign that you are describing is the one that my GM is running at the moment although we are of a higher level in the last six or seven eyars it has been going. I have been playing in his various SW games for about thirty years now in one flavour or another so I think your idea is great :D.
I also agree that SW is a fairly heavy ME clone, almost copy/paste style. That isn't surprising really as I remember reading somewhere that the early content was originally supposed to be placed in Middle Earth.
-
Both Quellbourne and Gryphon College were founded in the exodus of the intellectuals from Zor so there is also that link between the two.
There is a significant difference in the origin dates. Gryphon College already exists by the time Zor falls in 4980 SEI. Quellburn, according to the campaign module history, is founded by refugees during the Wars of Dominion. The only thing I wonder is where they were living before fleeing to Quellbourne, since Zor had been a wasteland for the past millenium and a half when they fled. Presumably, they were settled in the northwestern fringe of Zor.
I also agree that SW is a fairly heavy ME clone, almost copy/paste style. That isn't surprising really as I remember reading somewhere that the early content was originally supposed to be placed in Middle Earth.
Interesting take because my point of view is significantly different, mostly because of the chronology and science-fantasy influences. It is possible, even likely, that the very early drafts of the World of the Loremasters (before Shadow World was a thing) was heavily inspired by Middle Earth, and some of the names are shared between the early WotL modules and some ME campaign modules such as Court of Ardor and Shadow in the South. But even the similarity of the races is only skin-deep.
-
As a long-time Tolkien fan, who played and GMed in Middle Earth with RM2, I recognize the ME roots for most of the races/cultures in the Rolemaster Fantasy Role Playing System. I'm planning a campaign in Shadow World, since it offers a large canvas. I'm having trouble, though, fitting some of the races and cultures into the SW setting.
As others have already said - use the Master Atlases, and use the races included therein.
My particular challenge at the moment is where the southern empires that the Mariners are pining to recapture... I was trying to build a mixed man of the Mariner culture and wanted to know where to locate the empire of which they had been deprived by High Man betrayal (according to the Mariner viewpoint). My original GM made me a gift of several SW books, including the "Jaiman: Land of Twilight" module" and I was considering making them exiles from U-Lyshak. Would that work?
Probably not. Jaiman has not been the stage of a major displacement of population because of 'high men' (Laan or Zori) [I exclude the Sky Giants setting because TKA basically repudiated it and it was apparently written with a complete disregard of the overall Shadow World history].
Laan *did* displace many 'lesser' cultures in Emer, especially in Haestra during the rise of the Lords of Emer (some of the Shay people fled, including those who went north to Jaiman and became the Jameri people). But it is more than 9000 years ago, and the memory of it would have faded, especially since the Wars of Dominion occurred between then and now.
You could also use the expansion of the Emerian Empire in early Third Era (again in Emer). But the vanquished cultures were not 'mixed men' and, in most cases, were not displaced but absorbed (Jineri, Ochu, Jaaderi and Shay). The only marine culture among those would have been the Jineri.
You could still have your "displaced people" in Jaiman, but they would not be mixed men, and they would not have been displaced by 'high men'.
- it is likely that the Haid people fought against their neighbours several times. Some of them might have been displaced. The Syrkakar in Mur Fostisyr have been displaced, but not by high men.
- the people of Saralis, Ly-Aran and Xa-ar have been displaced by the invasions of the armies of Ulor (mostly Lugrôki and Pale Men).
Rhakhaan conquered Wuliris recently (and more or less lost it soon after), but they did not *displace* anyone - it was a conquest for acquisition, not for replacement.
Also, is there anywhere more details on Gryphon College? I am beginning a very low-level campaign in Quellborne, with plans for the players to be porter/guards for a trade caravan though the mountain pass through the Caldsfang/Dragonfang mountains that define the southern border of Quellborne, into Saralis and Rhakhaan.
If you start a low-level campaign in Quellbourne, Gryphon College is a long way away - being located in the foothills between Rhakhaan and Zor, your PCs would have to cross either Saralis or Zor before reaching it. There are probably interesting places closer to home :p
I would use Quellbourne in conjunction with the Iron Wind (Mur Fostisyr) and Xa-ar campaign modules. Iron Wind must be adapted a bit because of the time shift, but it can be a great source of inspiration with plenty of new people to meet and new locations to discover. Those two modules are the closest influences you can have to Quellbourne.
I still have trouble with the city of Quellburn being "prosperous" before its demise given the climate in Quellbourne, the fact that it was on a plateau and not at sea level, and the lack of arable land around (not to mention the many natural predators, the warlike neighbours, and the fact that two Orders Arnak are in the neighbourhood...). Trade would have been difficult - the sea routes have to go around Xa-ar and re-enter the Ulor Bay or go around Ly-Aran as well, and the land routes have to cross the Kaldsfang or Lu'Nak, then go through Saralis or Zor...
-
While there are quality responses today, this thread ended seven years ago in 2015.
I am curious as to how things worked out for Yseulte Harper...who hasn't logged into the forums since 2015.
-
While there are quality responses today, this thread ended seven years ago in 2015.
I am curious as to how things worked out for Yseulte Harper...who hasn't logged into the forums since 2015.
Here's the real curious thing: why did it show up in my feed - as an "unread since last visit" a couple of days ago, if the last post was back in 2015 and I was active many times since? The bots are messing up man. (I rarely look at the date.)
-
I think it was probably hit by spam, then the spam was deleted, but the thread still stayed marked as having an unread post.