Topic: Stellar System Generator Calculator

[arakish]

TGC will be publishing the paper version of my Stellar System Generator (SSG).  Another member over at RealRoleplaying asked me to think about making it into a spreadsheet.  I started with the spreadsheet, but when I realized that I was going to have to write program code to ensure certain calculations were done before others, I thought that I might as well make it into an app.

Below is the link to download the latest alpha version.  It is not completed yet and may have bugs I have not discovered.  There is no error checking.  I have not read up on how to implement this.  The last time I did any programming was back in the days of DOS (before Windows ever existed) using ASCII characters to draw windows (about 25+ years ago).  I am now using Visual Studio 10 and it is so far removed from what I did so long ago in a galaxy far, far away...

SSG-Calculator

From my understanding, unless you have a Windows 7 or Vista machine, you may need to download and install the latest VB Runtime Library:

VB Runtimes

Give it a try and let me know the good and bad.

Thanks.

rmfr

[enoch]

Every time I try to run it in Win7 it crashes pretty much immediately ("SSGCalc has stopped working"). Here's the output of the problem details.

Problem signature:
  Problem Event Name:   CLR20r3
  Problem Signature 01:   ssgcalc.exe
  Problem Signature 02:   1.0.0.0
  Problem Signature 03:   4dffbfa5
  Problem Signature 04:   SSGCalc
  Problem Signature 05:   1.0.0.0
  Problem Signature 06:   4dffbfa5
  Problem Signature 07:   2f
  Problem Signature 08:   e
  Problem Signature 09:   System.InvalidOperationException
  OS Version:   6.1.7601.2.1.0.256.48
  Locale ID:   1033
  Additional Information 1:   0a9e
  Additional Information 2:   0a9e372d3b4ad19135b953a78882e789
  Additional Information 3:   0a9e
  Additional Information 4:   0a9e372d3b4ad19135b953a78882e789

Read our privacy statement online:
  http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?linkid=104288&clcid=0x0409

If the online privacy statement is not available, please read our privacy statement offline:
  C:\Windows\system32\en-US\erofflps.txt

[arakish]

@enoch

Sorry, but I do not understand what the information you posted indicates.  I just figured it would run on Windows 7 since it is newer than Windows Vista.  I am using a Windows VistaSP2 machine to write the program and it works fine for me.  Of course, any program will always work on the machine it is written on.  I do not have multiple machines to test it on (except a Linux-SGI workstation).  Thus, the reason I released the alpha version for others to help in finding errors I might be able to resolve.

On a further note, SSG-Calc is written using Visual Basic inside Visual Studio 10.  The alpha build is based on the EXE file created when debugging the file, NOT a true build.  There may be something else that needs to be included.  I will look into VS10 and see if there is anything I can do from my end.

I wished I could help, but...

The last time I did any programming was back in the days of DOS (before Windows ever existed) using ASCII characters to draw windows (about 25+ years ago).  I am now using Visual Studio 10 and it is so far removed from what I did so long ago in a galaxy far, far away...

Is there a way to make it run under compatibility mode?  Is there compability mode on Windows 7?  Maybe you need to install the latest VB Runtime Libraries?  Again, I thought they would already be on Windows 7.

Any others having problems with the program?

rmfr

[TerryTee]

I'm running Windows 7 and can't even get the program to start. It crashes before I see the application. I get similar errors as enoch in the app log. I can list them for you if you'd like.
I trued the compatability trouble shooter, but it did not solve it.
 
-Terry

[arakish]

Another Windows 7 and won't run.

Found a crock of an answer on the forums.  For the debug EXE file to run, you would have to have Visual Studio 10 installed on your machine.  It seems I have to actually build the project for it to work.  I've never tried a build.  I'll give it try and post the result later.

Sorry about the problems.

rmfr

[arakish]

An MSDN forum administrator gave me this as possible solution.

"Make sure they have the latest .NET framework."

Doubt this will solve the problem, but you could try.

rmfr

[arakish]

Another MSDN forum poster gave me a walkthrough on creating a "deployment."  The walkthrough generated both a MSI file and a SETUP.EXE file.  I ran the MSI file and it installed just fine.  The program also ran fine.  It also uninstalled fine using the Programs and Features in Control Panel.

I do not know if the MSI file needs the setup.exe file or not.  I have not tried.

Please let me know if using the MSI file (SSG-CalcSetupWizard.msi) works.  And if it does install, if the program will run.

Thanks for being testers for me.

SSG-Calc Installers

rmfr

[enoch]

Success!

I've only made it through the first few tabs but everything is running smoothly so far. I'll keep playing with it and let you know if any problems arise.

[arakish]

I think I know what the problem was.  One of the included "dependent" files was the the Visual Basic Power Pack DLL.  Also, if you do not have the .NET Framework 4, the program won't run.

Again, sorry for the mess up.  I'll remember that I need to build a SetupWizard next time I decide to release an alpha version.

Thanks for the testing.  But remember, the program is not complete yet.  Also remember that, currently, all the program does is calculate parameter values.

rmfr

[arakish]

Okay, did some extensive printing and reading of creating setup files.  Also found why the build process makes a setup.exe and a SSG-CalcSetup.msi file.  The setup.exe file should be run if you do not have the .NET Framework 4 installed.  The setup.exe file will install the .NET Framework 4 and other dependent files before running the SSG-CalcSetup.msi installer.

If you run just the SSG-CalcSetup.msi, it will install the program and dependent dll files only.

Wished I knew this before previous post, I would have posted the below:

1) If you have the .NET Framework 4 (Windows 7 automatically has it, but not previous versions of Windows), then run the SSG-CalcSetup.msi file.

2) If you are not sure that you have the .NET Framework 4 installed, then run the setup.exe file.

Hope this helps some more.

Also, here is the latest alpha version.  It corrects a small calculation error in the Atmospheric Composition and Object Flux Hydrography tab pages.  Funny thing is the small errors never showed unless I looked at the code. 

SSG-Calculator

I am now reading up on how to save the data into a text file.  Never wrote a program to do this, so it may take a while.

I am also working on the procedures to generate the planets and moons.  This will take some complex coding and it may take a while.

As said before, it has been about 27+ years since I did any programming.  Found out Windows 1 came out in 1985.  Thus, it was no sooner than 1984 since I did programming.  Bear with me.

Thanks for the testing and reporting errors and the good and bad.

rmfr

[arakish]

Spent the past few days testing both the written version and the program version I am still writing.

First part of the written version may come out in July @ TGC.

The latest alpha version of SSG-Calc can be found at the below link.

SSG-Calculator

Just make sure to read the read1st.txt file.

A sort of guide on using the SSG-Calculator can be found at the below link.

SSG-Calc Guide

The guide should be extracted into its own folder.  Otherwise, the html file will not find the images of screen captures it uses.

Enjoy!

rmfr

[arakish]

Here is the latest update.  Fixed some minor errors that could produce some big mistakes.

Also, it is now in beta release.

http://www.4shared.com/file/aB4oXqwb/SSGCalc.html

rmfr

[arakish]

Here is the latest web-edition I have been working on.

Stellar System Generation

rmfr

[darb]

I really like the system and damn you have put a ton of work in on it!  But I can't seem to understand if it is supposed to have a 'generate' function or is more of a guide for a manual generation system.  The standalone doesn't seem to be available now, so I am guessing that was the generation application, are you planning on having the online version do the same?

It is really great timing for me by the way.  There are a couple of paper 4x games coming out with new versions in the near future and both of them have fairly anemic system generation, so this is great for me!

[arakish]

I really like the system and damn you have put a ton of work in on it!  But I can't seem to understand if it is supposed to have a 'generate' function or is more of a guide for a manual generation system.  The standalone doesn't seem to be available now, so I am guessing that was the generation application, are you planning on having the online version do the same?

It is really great timing for me by the way.  There are a couple of paper 4x games coming out with new versions in the near future and both of them have fairly anemic system generation, so this is great for me!

Thanks.  And, yes it was a ton of work.  The first edition I wrote back in 1984 and was never truly completed.  This is the first edition I have completed (mostly) and truly written for access on the Internet.  I am still researching and updating this SSG.

I am still working on a stand alone and web-based applications.  Remember, the last time I did any serious programming was with UNIX and DOS commands way back in 1982 (the last time I did any SERIOUS programming).  I am having to totally relearn my programming skills.  Thus, it may be a while before I can get a stand alone program completed.  My plans are for both: a stand alone and a web-based stand alone.  For both, I want them to save the data to a text file.  And the method for saving to a text file is proving to be exceptionally difficult compared to old days of "copy cout>savetext.txt" command.

The current SSG-Calculator is available on this page: Downloads.
Direct link at 4shared: SSG-Calc, just read the read1st.txt file first.
You can also download the Stellar System Generation section (@ 4shared) of my website for off-line use.  It is a fairly large file: 16,990,240 bytes.

It is really great timing for me by the way.  There are a couple of paper 4x games coming out with new versions in the near future and both of them have fairly anemic system generation, so this is great for me!

Kewl.  Enjoy.  What are those games?  I'd be interested in looking at them, if available.

On a further note, my initial plans for this web-edition of Stellar System Generation was to provide mini javascript apps to aid in the manual generation of a stellar system.  On some pages, there are larger generators that also provide copy and paste textboxes for you (direct links below).

Stellar Primary and
Celestial Body

Additionally, for the web-based edition, I wanted to provide some scientific discussion basis for the generation of a stellar system within the knowledge we currently know.  But I also wanted to make it so a general layman/hobbyist can understand it.  I can only hope that I have achieved these desires.

rmfr

[darb]

You are very brave to head back into programming after that long!  It is about the same for me, did a bit way back in the day, but then I couldn't motivate myself to get back into it the last 10 years or so.  Tip of the hat to you!

I really like your approach, but I was hoping for a random system generator as well, maybe i am just not seeing it.  i see some code that would generate a random star, but i don't see a way to actually generate a system.  this would make it more useful for a gm if you could make it generate an entire system with a button.  then the gm could go back and edit any data they wanted to.  your system is great but for most games it is helpful to have it generate rather than only compute data.  having a first page with 'generate system' and then output either to the copy/paste box or maybe csv format would be helpful.  if it does this i just didn't see it.  this is especially true because your system is quite crunchy.  for instance with the planet calculator, you ask for rotational period in seconds!  i am just not very likely to want to do the work to think wha that would be for any system body, let along a group of them!  i understand that this is probably not what you set out to design, but i hope the feedback is useful.

The games are Starfire and Victory by Any Means.  Very different takes on the 4x idea, starfire creaks underr its chrome weight, and VBAM is a bit eurogame in its lightness.  Starfires system design is fine, but a bit tedious without computer support.  VBAM is just a bit... abstract.  So you system hits right in the sweet spot for me.  The only thing I have to do is convert the system descriptions to stats, but that is no big deal. 

and i did enjoy the sceince discussion that went alng withth the sytem!  you definately succeeded in educating at least one small part of the 'masses'!

[arakish]

You are very brave to head back into programming after that long!  It is about the same for me, did a bit way back in the day, but then I couldn't motivate myself to get back into it the last 10 years or so.  Tip of the hat to you!

Don't know if I'd call it bravery.  Probably foolishness.  More likely non-sexual masochism.  But I'm trying.  Might take a year or two, but I'm trying.  Have to admit, programming is so different than when I did it "a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away."

I really like your approach, but I was hoping for a random system generator as well, maybe i am just not seeing it.  i see some code that would generate a random star, but i don't see a way to actually generate a system.  this would make it more useful for a gm if you could make it generate an entire system with a button.  then the gm could go back and edit any data they wanted to.  your system is great but for most games it is helpful to have it generate rather than only compute data.

Sorry if I caused any confusion.  Currently, there is no simple "generate stellar system" function, yet.  That is what I am still working on.  Again, programming is so different than when I did it "a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away."  I am literally having to reteach myself as if I never had any programming experience.  Even when I took the C++ course in college, it was so different than the old, original C I used way back when.  Most often, I find myself saying, "Why in 7734 did these ___holes make everything so damned difficult.  It was so much simpler back then."  But, computers are more complicated, thus, the programs need to be more complicated.  Or, the programs need to handle more complicated functions.

having a first page with 'generate system' and then output either to the copy/paste box or maybe csv format would be helpful.  if it does this i just didn't see it.  this is especially true because your system is quite crunchy.  for instance with the planet calculator, you ask for rotational period in seconds!  i am just not very likely to want to do the work to think wha that would be for any system body, let along a group of them!  i understand that this is probably not what you set out to design, but i hope the feedback is useful.

Thanks!!  The feedback is actually very useful.  Perhaps I should include a method for users to enter the rotational period in days, hours, minutes, and/or seconds and use the program to convert to total seconds.  I never thought of that.  Thanks for the feedback.  I will keep this in mind as I continue working on the program.  One problem I have is that I assume (ass-u-me) everyone else knows what I am talking about when I say things like "rotational period must be seconds."

and i did enjoy the sceince discussion that went alng withth the sytem!  you definately succeeded in educating at least one small part of the 'masses'!

Such high praise.  Make an old man blush with pride.  A teacher's greatest pride comes when a student says, "Oh, I see."  At least, one of my college instructors told me that his greatest pride that came from teaching is seeing that "light bulb" light up in a student's head.

Be nice if more would give me feedback.  Good or Bad, I would accept it.

rmfr