Topic: Animals Full Attack

[markc]

  Read the other thread about parry animals attacks; It was  put forth by Lord Miller that animals when they attack do so in a manner that they use full OB. IMO yes that is the case but I do allow animals that have been trained for battle as well as more intelligent animals the option of a OB/DB split. I also allow Were creatures at times to make a check to see if they are in "human" mode, "animal" mode or "human-animal" mode and allow them to adjust there OB/DB accordingly.

 Is there any other type of creature that you allow to make a split OB/DB? [BTW this is also why some people think some monsters are more powerful then them as they go all out and PC's have to go threw numerous "encounters" and the creatures only have to deal with one encounter.

MDC

[Marc R]

OB/DB generally applies to footwork also, so it will generally cover the logic of evasion without necissarily meaning parry.

Recall, that animals get a 50% penalty for parry vs weapons, due to the fact that it's hard to block a blade or point with a paw. . .

My point in the other thread was that for many animals, they only attack when provoked and unable to flee, which often prompts an all out attack. (Akin to the attack provoked if you attempt to restrain someone fleeing in fear.)

[markc]

 I never have used the 50% parry rule with animals. I think I like that.
MDC

[craggles]

I've not thought of the 'normal' animals would use parry (but I use parry for the more intelligent monsters) - but it's only because I'd never really thought of it.

But I suppose they do actually do parry - I remember nature programs where the big cat would try to deflect the stick/spear out of the way before jumping in for the kill.

From now on I'll have parrying animals if cornered and applying the half parry rule as well - including the PCs themselves against animals! (Those dam PCs can't get it too easy)

...which leads me to another thought that just popped into my head that I may have been dealing with the 'half parry rule' for 2H vs 1H weapons wrong all this time...

As it's difficult for a creature to use 100% to parry a weapon, like you can only use half OB of a 2H weapon to parry a 1H weapon, does this mean that you need to split your parry 50/50% between OB/DB in those situations OR does it mean that you need to use your FULL (100%) OB to gain half the amount in the parry (so whatever OB you put in the parry gets halved for the attack)?

...or is that just me being a devious GM?

And just one more question - I had an encounter with Wargs yesterday (I was using an old MERP adventure book but using RMFRP rules) and I realised that Wargs aren't in the C&M book. What would they be? (I used the great boar but used Bash instead of it's Tusk attack)

[Marc R]

The 50% rule, means you get half benefit. . .so if you put 40 OB into parry, it only gives 20 DB. . .which is merely a variation of the unarmed parry vs armed rule, since almost all animals/monsters are unarmed. . .some animals should get full parry benefit due to having a weapon or armor section to block attacks that is not akin to just taking a hit.

i.e.

if a bear blocks a sword, it will get cut, so it only gains 50% benefit from parry.

but

is a giant crab blocks a sword, it can do so with an armored body part, so it should get full parry.

the same kind of logic as saying that an unarmed man wearing armor, or holding something they can block with, like a stool or platter doesn't suffer the 50% penalty either.

[craggles]

Wow - I can't believe I've been taking it as only allowed to use 50% to parry (and then attack with the other 50%) as opposed to halving whatever you put into parry for so long.

My PCs will not be pleased with my correct understanding.

[Arioch]

i.e.

if a bear blocks a sword, it will get cut, so it only gains 50% benefit from parry.

But parry is not only blocking!
It also includes dodging and trying to avoid being hit in general, and imho animals should as good as humans in dodging attacks...

And just one more question - I had an encounter with Wargs yesterday (I was using an old MERP adventure book but using RMFRP rules) and I realised that Wargs aren't in the C&M book. What would they be? (I used the great boar but used Bash instead of it's Tusk attack)

I hope your character met them, not you  

Wargs are basically big bad wolves (those who attacked the Fellowship neat the gates of Moria): I'd use the Ghost Wolf stats for true wargs (since in the book their bodies disappeared after being slain).

[craggles]

Thanks - I'll go compare it to the battle boars I used.

[Marc R]

Arioch, true, and a poor choice of wording on my part, between the technical and vernacular use of "parry", I'll use the word "Parry" just in terms of it's RM rules use, and use the word "Deflect" in place of the casual vernacular use of the word "Parry" . . . what you said is the reason the unarmed-unarmored get any parry at all.

Now, the term "Parry" in RM technically applies to how much OB you put into DB and covers the concepts of both evading and stopping attacks.

The person with something they can block or deflect with can:

Block, deflect, dodge or evade

The person without something they can block or deflect with can:

dodge or evade

Hence, a bear can dodge or evade, but it cannot really deflect or block without actually placing part of its body in harm's way. A result of "Bear sticks paw in way and your sword sinks into it 4 inches" is a critical result, not a successful parry. So it takes a 50% penalty to any OB it puts into Parry to reflect that limitation.

[markc]

Craggles:
 IMO for wargs I would use large wolves but also most MERP modules that I have have stats for the wargs using the MERP rules and IMO often the MERP stats can be used instead of recreating the monster in RMSS/FRP. But there are some cases in which MERP stats should not be used for RMSS/FRP and those are generally high stat and high level monsters.

MDC 

[craggles]

Thanks for that - I'll use the stats in the MERP module in that case as they're a little beafier than the Wolf in C&M.

Against my PCs, beafyness is key to keep them on their toes and to punish stupidity!
(One PC was getting quite bored with finding out more of the story with the other PCs and went to open the Warg pen just for some action - little did he know that door to the room he left shut closed behind him so his plan of bringing the whole party into a Warg encounter failed as he was the only one there. He is only young but that's no reason to excuse foolishness like that)

[rdanhenry]

Note that during the reign of the old ICE, an official ruling was given (by Craig O'Brien) that animals could parry (although in ordinary language it would be described more as "dodging").

I also have saved an old ruling that specifically describes the 50% limit as only using up to 50% of OB to parry, not halving what OB you do use. I do think, however, that both interpretations have been used for a very long time.