Topic: shield DB

[Right Wing Wacko]

Maybe even make it a Combat Maneuver that has to be learned...

Hmmm....

[Witchking20k]

That would be a good expansion on the Talent however, Shield Training 1 allows the PC to use the full DB of a shield vs a single opponent in combat.  Shield Training 2 allows the PC to apply the Shield bonus -10 to a second attacker.

[kreider204]

OK, here's my latest thinking on my house rule:

- Normally, Shield DB is only applied to one attack per round, and that attack cannot be from the rear.
- If the character is performing a full parry, then the shield DB might apply to more than one attack, depending on the shield size:
--- Large shields (e.g., wall shields, full shields) can protect against up to three melee attacks per round, and against all standard missile attacks in addition (e.g., arrows, sling bullets, crossbow bolts), but all the attacks must come from generally the same direction.
--- Medium shields (e.g., normal shields) can protect against up to two attacks per round (melee or missile), but all the attacks must come from generally the same direction.
--- Small shields (e.g., target shields, bucklers, shielding weapons) still protect against only one attack per round (melee or missile).

[Right Wing Wacko]

OK, here's my latest thinking on my house rule:

- Normally, Shield DB is only applied to one attack per round, and that attack cannot be from the rear.
- If the character is performing a full parry, then the shield DB might apply to more than one attack, depending on the shield size:
--- Large shields (e.g., wall shields, full shields) can protect against up to three melee attacks per round, and against all standard missile attacks in addition (e.g., arrows, sling bullets, crossbow bolts), but all the attacks must come from generally the same direction.
--- Medium shields (e.g., normal shields) can protect against up to two attacks per round (melee or missile), but all the attacks must come from generally the same direction.
--- Small shields (e.g., target shields, bucklers, shielding weapons) still protect against only one attack per round (melee or missile).

Looks good! I will probably use yours above in my game 

How about handing out a few idea points to those who contributed?

And have an idea point yourself!

[kreider204]

Heh, sure thing -- I'm new here, forgot about the idea points.  :-)

[Pat]

We recently had this discussion in our group and decided the following:

Without Shield Talent you get basic shield bonus against one opponent only. (Must also be the person you attack. ie you don't have the skill to block one opponent and attack a different one)

With Shield Talent you get shield bonus against 4 positions: The 3 in front of the character and the point to the left of the character (if the players uses shield in his left hand). So it would be:

                  YYY
                  YXN
                  NNN

Y - Yes shield bonus
N - No shield bonus
X - character

[kreider204]

I like it, though it might require use of minatures or some such thing to guage positions -- good for those who use minatures, bad for those who don't (like me -- too lazy. 

[Karizma]

I like it, though it might require use of minatures or some such thing to guage positions -- good for those who use minatures, bad for those who don't (like me -- too lazy. 

RM:SS gave the following idea for those that didn't use hexes: Since rounds were ten seconds, it could easily be assumed that during this time, a combatant will always move about to keep himself not flanked.  An individual can face three enemies, but any more than that becomes problematic. A totally surrounded combatant will have 3 Front, 2 Flank, and 1 Rear.

This is great, but rounds are only 2 seconds.  I might rule "Common Sense" on who is in "front" of the PC to block and who is not.  But the premise is nice.

[Thom @ ICE]

In case anyone is curious.... last September Rasyr's response on this question was:

Quote from: galadhil1 on September 01, 2008, 10:22:43 pm

Does the defensive bonues from shields apply to all opponents or are they limited to one or two assailants?

The shield modifier to DB applies to all attacks to the front of the character and to the side on which the shield is held (flank) if the character has shield training. If the character does not have shield training, then I would reduce the area covered slightly.

[kreider204]

Is that actually in the rules or errata anywhere?  I looked everywhere, and couldn't find anything.

Anyway, I'm gonna stick with my house rule.  :-)

[Thom @ ICE]

Rasyr posted that on 9/2/08 on this thread...
http://www.ironcrown.com/ICEforums/index.php?topic=7314.0

I found it by doing a search in the HARP, HARP House Rules, and HARP Archives folders on the keywords, "Shield" "Multiple"

[Right Wing Wacko]

Anyway, I'm gonna stick with my house rule.  :-)

Yeah... me too!

[kreider204]

Cool, thanks TJones.

[Thom @ ICE]

No problem - just remember that even though Rasyr posted it, since he did not mark it in the special color it is not an official ruling - but it is still his comment and it responds to your question so while it may not be "official" you are getting it from him directly.

As for the ruling itself - I think a modified version of your house rule (considering his comments) would be the way to go....

Regardless of anything else -
1) Shields never provide protection from the rear.
2) Shields only provide defense against attacks from 1 general direction

Melee Attack                            # of Foes Defended
Shield Size             Untrained             Trained      Trained - Full Parry
Small                           1                       1                    1
Medium                        1                       2                    3
Large                           2                       3                    4

Missile Attack                            # of Foes Defended
Shield Size             Untrained             Trained      Trained - Full Parry
Small                           0                      1                     1
Medium                        1                      2                     3
Large                           3                     4                 Unlimited

[Right Wing Wacko]

TJones...
Looks good! I am sure kreider204 will appreciate it too!

[kreider204]

It does look good, though it gets more toward the realism side of things than I probably need.

[jasonbrisbane]

Earlier Pat said:

<snip>

I know Rasyr had posted something somewhere,  but none of us could state definitively whether we HAD seen it or whether it was a suggestion from someone so we all agreed on it...