Topic: Humans, Metamorphs, and Gods

[Zedul]

PART ONE

As we are talking about the power restrictions of the Rolemaster campaign I wanted to put things in context.  In this thread I am going to show how I run an epic campaign without losing control and allowing over inflation and power creep.

Everything must have context, there must be limitations to a universe, even in fantasy universe full of the supernatural.

The best way to start is to examine our world and the humans that populate it.  Let's examine a Rolemaster baseline.

In the Rolemaster system we role or assign stats on a 1 to 100 basis.  In some cases PC's may start with a 102 stat!  Is this realistic to start with a stat that exceeds a 100?  Do we assume that anyone on planet earth in our reality even has a 100 stat?

First answer: yes

Ursain Bolt has been clocked at 27.3 Miles Per Hour with by an accurate device or "radar gun" made in germany.  We could consider this his "dashing" speed or top speed he has been measured achieving during the course of a race.  Now, several other athletes can probably hit this as well, perhaps achieve it.  Showing that raw quickness does not win a race (but certainly helps).  There is some skill in "dashing" involved.  But let's set that aside for the raw speed.

A player character who is a "common man" 6'5 tall (the height of Bolt) with a 100 Quickness can dash at exactly (50' base +25 mod + 5 height mod) x5 pace multiplier for 400 feet per round, or 27.2 miles per hour (400 x 6 rounds per minute x 60 minutes per hour)/5280

So what we are saying here is that Bolt as roughly the equivalent to a 100 Quickness stat in Rolemaster.

Uncanny huh?

So it seems right from the start that we have a sound basis for establishing a top end ability and stats and at least in regards to quickness they are perfectly accurate.  So it would be safe to say in our world we will run across people with "100" stats in abilities, and perhaps there even exists a mere mortal with a 101 or 102 stat?  We could consider that Einstein for example had a "102" reasoning, or that some movie stars or historical figures had a "101" Presence.

This is our base point.

Now let us examine an extreme... the fastest non human creature that we know exists in nature, the tiger beetle.

If a tiger beetle were human sized it could run at 240 miles per hour or 3,520 feet per round.

The tiger beetle has 6 legs instead of 2 so I am going to divide its speed by 3 right away to break it down to "2 legs" like a human.  I come up with 1173, which I am going to round off to 1175, now I am going to divide by 5 to get a 235 walking pace, and from that I subtract 50 and come up with a +185 Quickness modification.  Using the expanded stat mods in the RoCo 1 I find that a +185 Quickness mod translates to a stat of 132.

Meaning that the fastest runner in nature has the Equivalent of a 132 Quickness stat.

I now have a basis or a "cap" of nature.  From this I can look at my campaign and say that any naturally occurring creature that is not a god, or demi god and is at the "extreme" end of the spectrum is going to have 132 stat limitation.

I can also say... this is the limit of what a physical body in our universe can handle.  So, no matter how much a player character is enhanced magically, I am going to make it a hard rule that a 132 stat can never be exceeded even with the most potent artifacts ever conceived.  Likewise I am going to impose a stat modification cap of +185 on Quickness.

Not that a player character will ever get there in the first place, but now I have a working basis for saying why they cannot.

I call this "quick and dirty fantasy physics".

end part one





 

[rdanhenry]

If a tiger beetle were human sized, its legs would snap like old wood and it would suffocate. It would therefore have a movement rate of zero.

[Zedul]

If a tiger beetle were human sized, its legs would snap like old wood and it would suffocate. It would therefore have a movement rate of zero.

Your post is both glib and based on an inaccurate understanding of why insects are small:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/10/061012093716.htm

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/10/101029132924.htm

It's obvious to me that I have nothing more to add to any of these discussions, and my time is limited so carry on.

[Usdrothek]

Now I'm puzzled.

rdanhenry's point about insects suffocating if they were suddenly as large as a human is correct. Oxygen diffusion and all that.....something the very links you posted concur with. Unless we are suddenly talking about your world being a super oxygenated environment?

To support it's weight, the human sized beetle would need proportionally thicker, less spindly legs than in it's actual form.

I think your dismissal is rash. 

Anyhow...this isn't about 'reality' and how to model it, you're explaining your epic rules.

[providence13]

Zedul, I appreciate your efforts here. It's a good idea to establish a baseline for certain values in the campaign. Others may disagree with the way you determine the numbers, but that doesn't take away from what you're trying to do; define an epic game.

In my particular game, I may want 100's to be a little more rare, but have skill make up the difference. The famed runner knew that he could beat his own record. To me, this is an improvement on skill, because he couldn't improve his stats. This assumes modeling in a RPG, game system where stats determine these values.

I do love a giant beetle attack! But the points raised show how scaling is rarely proportional to what we expect. I see where you're going with the established baseline. But that baseline is for tiger beetles.

No matter what anyone says, it doesn't detract from your years of experience and the fact the the players love the game.
If you post your history, rules and opinion, people may respond in an unexpected manner. My good friends would consider the feedback so far, kind. They would still show up to my games, but if they thought there was a hole in my logic, they'd drive a bus through it. This wouldn't stop us from being friends.

[Cormac Doyle]

Surely the concept of 0-100 represents the normal limits; for a race (or creature) that is consistently faster/slower/stronger/weaker, we then add racial modifiers

Thus you use the 1-100 to identify the relative strength between equal opponents, and the net bonus between opponents of different stature ?

Your demi-god may "only" have a stat of 100 ... but they also have a "racial" stat bonus of +15 (thus allowing for us to model multiple demigods against one another and identify which is stronger ... )

This method means that instead of having all of your gods with stat bonuses in the 100-110 range (you postulated 100-132), you have them with stat bonuses between 1-100 (a BUGGER range), but with a racial stat bonus that shifts the bonus beyond the reach of "mere mortals"

RM has always worked linke this ...