Topic: Stat Bonuses

[markc]

GoblynByte,
 If I remember correctly Will is from the Treasure Comp and it is a mesure of how a char can deal with intelegent magic items. But having said that I think the rule is the same in The Alc Comp of RM2 fame.

 Lord Miller,
 Where is the -100 stat topic you are quoting? Is it new in RMC?


As to all the ideas if you are short a stat or have extra stats you just use a multiplication factor to make it right. I can understand that it may trouble some people but it can be fixed IMO which a simple chart so everyone does not have to be a math wiz. So no matter what system or style you use you can have it fit the mold of the game system.

MDC

[GoblynByte]

As to all the ideas if you are short a stat or have extra stats you just use a multiplication factor to make it right. I can understand that it may trouble some people but it can be fixed IMO which a simple chart so everyone does not have to be a math wiz. So no matter what system or style you use you can have it fit the mold of the game system.

MDC

'Cause, really, what's one more chart in Rolemaster? 

[yammahoper]

Will works like this;

Method one (official); Item has a level, say 70.  PC attempts to resist items influence or dominate the item, needs to resist level 70 attack, adds WILL to rr, subtracts items will, how much rr is made or missed by is refered to the will contest results table.

Method two (house rule); Player roles open ended d100 and adds will, item rolls open ended d100 and adds will, subtract lower from higher, refer to will contest table.

lynn

[Marc R]

Will scale: If it's 5 stats added, or 5 stats averaged, the only difference is that if there is a difference, it tends to be exagerated in "add" form.

i.e. average of 5 +20 stats vs 5 +5 stats. . .if you average, you are adding 20 and subtracting 5 from the RR if you add then you are adding 120 and subtracting 25 from the RR. . .which makes for two rather different RR results.

Just seemed an odd "Off" method. . .then again, it makes for "Artifacts" with +25 stats and +125 Wills used at say 70 or 100 level rather hard to resist. . .(can anyone say "One ring to bind them"?)

MarKc,

the -100 bonus is nowhere in the rules, it's just something that came up when we did 40 pages of "Linear stat logic" discussion. . . .

-100 is the "Down" penalty, implying that -100 is ultimately the penalty that means "neigh impossible".

Contrasted to the way vs stat issues come up, like say:

Undead drain on a human and dwarf, both have 90 Con (+10 bonus). . .human has +5 racial bonus, Dwarf has +20 bonus.

Technically, the way Con drain from undead, or stat drain from evil spells work, both will go down at 0 con at the same moment if drained equally. . .but, the dwarf objectively has more Con (more bonus) so he should take longer to drain down.

Now, way up above we already resolved that the bonus is the objective measure, and stat is just the subjective measure within your race. . .

So drains, an "objective" event. . .should drain bonus, not stat. . .and you should get progressibely weaker (or stupider, or whatever) trending toward a collapse point at -100 bonus (or -33.3 bonus in RMSS scale). . .i.e. at RM2 -100 strength bonus you are too weak to move, much like if you are "down" you are at -100 to everything and too incapacitated to do anything useful without a heroic roll.

Currently the system uses stat for these. . .with 0 stat meaning incapacity. . .which means if you drain 10 temp Con from a Cyclops vs 10 temp con from a pixie, you've drained a lot more from the cyclops than the pixie. (It means spells and effects drain a subjective percentage of the creature's total, rather than an objective amount.)

The "Percentage of total" may work OK, but it just seems to make more sense to me that a Con Drain should take down twinks faster than giants.

[markc]

GB, 
 I agree that what RM needs are more charts, after all you can copyright charts but not words. Just kidding.

LM,
 Thanks, for the heads up. I have used a life point system that is based on Con and other stats for undead draining and sometimes forget it is a house rule and the offical undead rules are -100 stat.
 Also as you point out that drain effects are vastly different in big creatures than in small ones. But IMO the only way that it would work is if you have a system that believes that thier is more life in a giant than in the smallest creature. Or are you draining the soul in which you have to rule if one soul is bigger than another.

MDC 

[Marc R]

well, technically the core system has you "Down" at 0 stat. . . .

If the undead drain is "Con" which seems to be vitality. . .and in any other instance, Con means bonus. (Like vs poison or for hits).

But, if a "robust" (high con) human takes longer than a "sickly" (low con) human. . .shouldn't a more "robust" dwarf take even longer?

Try not to get too sidetracked into the logic of Con drains, even though it's the easiest example to use, since so many people house rule it. . .like the "Life Levels" rule is good if you define it as life force drain, which has a seperate logic. It's more a general issue of how stats go down or up when you use an effect against them directly.

If you make those changes to the stat, then apply the bonus, they have a totally different look than if you do it to the final bonus.

For instance, the dwarf above, with his +20 con bonus, will slide from +30 to +20 fast, then remain very robust (+20 con) all the way across that big +/-0 area at the center of the table, and only begin dropping toward "normal" as they are about to die. . .

The human above will slip from +15 to +5 fast, then stick at +5 for a long time, and drop to "Normal" quite fast. . .

And both characters at 1 Temp con will be at penalties scaled to about "Stunned". . .you'd think that right on the cusp of dying from a con drain, a character would be barely functional, at say. . .-99?

If drains are objective and apply directly to the bonus. . .then the dwarf would merely be +15 ahead of the human in how much Con drain they could take. . .both would get progressively weaker in a more linear manner, getting more and more impaired as they slide down the negatives before completely failing into impotence at -100 bonus.

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

Nobody ever said that RM's stats were done logically... heheh

[markc]

LM,
 I agree I adjust the life pont total for racial mods as you said it only makes sense. I have also tened to find that in my case the penalty of -1 per point of life point lost works very well. But as you can tell the more you have the bigger your possible penalty and I still keep the "death" point at 0. This also makes the PC's look for someone who can heal life points quickly as I generally have it take 1-2 weeks [adjusted by race and talents] to heal 1 life point. And if you use the optional lists for clerics [and paladins in my game] your cleric may not have learned the list.   
 As you also state the Con example is the most common but for spells IMO you almost have to work out a code or something to make sure you get all the skills that the stat covers. Of course it is harder in RMSS/FRP than in RM2/C/E because of the # of skills. I generally play it by ear with tempory effects on stats for PC's and monsters.   


MDC