Author Topic: Provinces of Rhakhaan  (Read 6492 times)

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Offline RandalThor

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Provinces of Rhakhaan
« on: August 04, 2018, 06:16:56 PM »
Is there a list of the provinces anywhere? Specifically where they are located. I have seen the map with them, but it is pretty-small and if I zoom in to try and read them, they get too blurry. (Damn getting old anyway!)
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Offline Jenkyna

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2018, 09:17:58 PM »
Is there a list of the provinces anywhere? Specifically where they are located. I have seen the map with them, but it is pretty-small and if I zoom in to try and read them, they get too blurry. (Damn getting old anyway!)

I believe there is are newly done maps coming with Jaiman. Terry showed some teasers in the random updates thread.

They're sort of done in Pete's mapmaking style. Makes me wish Pete would do a map for one of the new books.

Offline Terry K. Amthor

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2018, 05:28:41 AM »
There is a map of Rhakhaan with all the provinces that originally was on the back cover of Haalkitaine, and will be reprinted inside the new Jaiman. Haalkitaine also listed many important nobles and the demesnes they were granted. It might be useful in the upcoming 2nd Edition of Haalkitaine to list the provinces separately, though there is a tangle of Duchies, Counties, etc...
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Offline egdcltd

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2018, 07:47:34 AM »
Not sure if this will be approved, but I'm uploading the rear cover of Haalkitaine. Might be useful until the new supplements are out.
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Offline Spectre771

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2018, 08:21:27 AM »
Eeek!
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=Haalkitaine&_sacat=0

$175 + shipping for Haalkitaine!

I'm going to start selling all my books and buying the new releases of same said books!
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let's all be heroes and run away!

Offline egdcltd

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2018, 08:33:12 AM »
Eeek!
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=Haalkitaine&_sacat=0

$175 + shipping for Haalkitaine!

I'm going to start selling all my books and buying the new releases of same said books!

$594.55 + shipping if you want it new from Amazon. Boy, I wish I'd bought the other two copies of it when I got mine!
I made some things! Azukail Games

Offline Terry K. Amthor

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2018, 10:25:21 AM »
Eeek!
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=Haalkitaine&_sacat=0

$175 + shipping for Haalkitaine!

I'm going to start selling all my books and buying the new releases of same said books!

$594.55 + shipping if you want it new from Amazon. Boy, I wish I'd bought the other two copies of it when I got mine!

*GASP* I had no idea. And I thought I made a mint when I sold my last spare pristine Court of Ardor for $450. several years ago.
Terry K. Amthor
Shadow World Author, Rolemaster & SpaceMaster Co-Designer, ICE co-founder.
Eidolon Studio Art Director


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
-- Clarke's First Law.

Offline egdcltd

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2018, 10:41:49 AM »
Eeek!
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=Haalkitaine&_sacat=0

$175 + shipping for Haalkitaine!

I'm going to start selling all my books and buying the new releases of same said books!

$594.55 + shipping if you want it new from Amazon. Boy, I wish I'd bought the other two copies of it when I got mine!

*GASP* I had no idea. And I thought I made a mint when I sold my last spare pristine Court of Ardor for $450. several years ago.

I'm starting to think that the next item I need to purchase for my RPG collection is a shrink wrapping machine! Even though I've gone berserk with PDF purchases, I still have quite a lot of stuff from the late 70s to early 90s. Most used admittedly (apart from a couple of MERP modules that I never opened back in the day and now don't want to), and some with scribbles in, but still...
I made some things! Azukail Games

Offline Spectre771

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2018, 02:58:09 PM »


I'm starting to think that the next item I need to purchase for my RPG collection is a shrink wrapping machine! Even though I've gone berserk with PDF purchases, I still have quite a lot of stuff from the late 70s to early 90s. Most used admittedly (apart from a couple of MERP modules that I never opened back in the day and now don't want to), and some with scribbles in, but still...

Just say they must have been the designer's copies and those are their margin notes from the development and playtesting days.  You must have been sent the originals by mistake.
If discretion is the better valor and
cowardice the better part of judgment,
let's all be heroes and run away!

Offline Jenkyna

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2018, 08:18:34 PM »
*GASP* I had no idea. And I thought I made a mint when I sold my last spare pristine Court of Ardor for $450. several years ago.

So you literally found a way to print your own money legally. :D

Offline Jraffa

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2018, 10:17:27 PM »
Used ICE products are getting harder and harder to find. My last good find was a year ago in Everett, WA. at a Half Price Books. $6.50 for "Riders of Rohan". Very nice copy with map. They're on to us now though, anything ICE is taken off the shelves and locked in their "rare cabinet" with a high price tag.

Offline Jenkyna

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2018, 12:07:19 AM »
Used ICE products are getting harder and harder to find. My last good find was a year ago in Everett, WA. at a Half Price Books. $6.50 for "Riders of Rohan". Very nice copy with map. They're on to us now though, anything ICE is taken off the shelves and locked in their "rare cabinet" with a high price tag.


I kind of like the fact that they are kind of like rare books or comics now. It's a testament to how important they were to a lot of people.

Offline Neee-Wom

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2018, 02:28:29 AM »
Not sure if this will be approved, but I'm uploading the rear cover of Haalkitaine. Might be useful until the new supplements are out.

I think it's the same map you can find at TKA's website: http://www.eidolonstudio.com/Shadow_World/Maps.html

An empire can have provinces, but at the same time, a feudal society does not work properly that way, and it's funny. What happens when the baron of X inside the county of Y is also the marquiss of Z and tries to end this bond towards the count? Should we change the borders?

Imagine the terrible things that happened in Europe during the middle ages when kings of England had to humiliate in front of kings of France to do not lose the rights to Normandy or Aquitaine.
Ni!

Offline RandalThor

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2018, 02:38:10 AM »
There is a map of Rhakhaan with all the provinces that originally was on the back cover of Haalkitaine, and will be reprinted inside the new Jaiman. Haalkitaine also listed many important nobles and the demesnes they were granted. It might be useful in the upcoming 2nd Edition of Haalkitaine to list the provinces separately, though there is a tangle of Duchies, Counties, etc...
I hope it is of higher quality (bigger, basically) than the one linked to above, because that one is too small to zoom in and read - for me at least.

Basically, I think the new Haalkitaine/Rhakhaan book could use a listing of the various provinces (or whatever they are called in a feudal society) and where they are located. I don't need all the nobles, just what the area is called.
Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Scratch that. Power attracts the corruptible.

Rules should not replace the brain and thinking.

Offline Terry K. Amthor

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2018, 03:12:40 AM »
There is a map of Rhakhaan with all the provinces that originally was on the back cover of Haalkitaine, and will be reprinted inside the new Jaiman. Haalkitaine also listed many important nobles and the demesnes they were granted. It might be useful in the upcoming 2nd Edition of Haalkitaine to list the provinces separately, though there is a tangle of Duchies, Counties, etc...
I hope it is of higher quality (bigger, basically) than the one linked to above, because that one is too small to zoom in and read - for me at least.

Basically, I think the new Haalkitaine/Rhakhaan book could use a listing of the various provinces (or whatever they are called in a feudal society) and where they are located. I don't need all the nobles, just what the area is called.

The Rhakhaan map used in the Jaiman 2nd ed, (and also will appear in the Haalk 2nd ed) is the print-quality PDF from the original book, so the type will all be vector-crisp.
Terry K. Amthor
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Eidolon Studio Art Director


"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
-- Clarke's First Law.

Offline egdcltd

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2018, 08:14:23 AM »


I'm starting to think that the next item I need to purchase for my RPG collection is a shrink wrapping machine! Even though I've gone berserk with PDF purchases, I still have quite a lot of stuff from the late 70s to early 90s. Most used admittedly (apart from a couple of MERP modules that I never opened back in the day and now don't want to), and some with scribbles in, but still...

Just say they must have been the designer's copies and those are their margin notes from the development and playtesting days.  You must have been sent the originals by mistake.

Given that it's my handwriting, most of the scribbles could be anything. I can't read my handwriting, it's that bad. I should have been a doctor...
I made some things! Azukail Games

Offline Hurin

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2018, 10:52:48 AM »

Basically, I think the new Haalkitaine/Rhakhaan book could use a listing of the various provinces (or whatever they are called in a feudal society)...

In medieval Europe the largest subdivisions (below kingdoms) were generally called duchies and counties. The duchies tended to be former kingdoms or important counties that were located in border regions, so their rulers got expanded independence and privileges. Technically a duke outranked a count, though in practice (and especially after centuries of private wars between nobles) some counts could overshadow some dukes if they were able to expand their holdings. In England, the closest analogues would be Earldom (like a duchy) and shire (like a county); in Germany, the word for duke was 'herzog', and the word for count was 'graf'.

The borders between 'feudal' principalities shifted constantly, so it would probably be a mistake to think of these as 'states' in the way the states in the USA have set boundaries. If the duke of New York State conquered Newark (New Jersey) from the count of New Jersey, he might incorporate it into an expanded New York State. People in the area might continue to think of Newark as part of the region of New Jersey, but for administrative and military purposes, Newark would now be a part of New York; and after centuries of that, people might even start to describe Newark in colloquial terms as part of New York. Similarly, in the Middle Ages, when Celtic invaders from Britain conquered parts of the old Roman region of Armorica, people started calling it 'Brittany'. And when Vikings conquered another part of it centuries later, people started calling it 'Northman-dy', or as we call it today, 'Normandy'.

The old Roman provincial names often survived, at least amongst academic writers. The church or course retained the Roman diocesan system, and it still had its provinces (the head of a church province was an archbishop). So you will find ecclesiastical writers for example still calling the area 'Armorica' even centuries after ordinary people had stopped calling it that.
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Offline egdcltd

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2018, 11:19:12 AM »
Actually, our earls are the equivalent of a European count. That's why earls are married to countesses. For some reason (I can't remember why now) we started reusing the title of earl.
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Offline Hurin

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2018, 12:04:27 PM »
Actually, our earls are the equivalent of a European count. That's why earls are married to countesses.

Nowadays, yes; I was describing the way things worked in the earlier Middle Ages, at the time of the 'feudal revolution' (turn of  the tenth/eleventh century). At that time, earl (eorl) was more akin to jarl (to which it is etymologically linked) or duke. The earldom of Wessex or Northumbria, for example, included multiple shires (counties); the earldom of Mercia included Shropshire, Stafforshire, Herefordshire, Worcestershire, Warwickshire, etc. Thus I think we can say that the greater earldoms at least were then more akin to a German stem-duchy like Bavaria or Saxony (which also had formerly been independent kingdoms and also included multiple counties/shires). Thus, when Latin authors translated the names of Anglo-Saxon earls into Latin, they usually translated their title as 'dux' (duke) rather than 'comes' (count). Admittedly, though the terms were already becoming so muddied on the continent that they could at times be interchangeable. It might then be best to view the greater earls as 'dukes', since they ruled multiple counties, but the lesser ones (like Byrhtnoth, who ruled just one shire/county and led its fyrd to the Battle of Maldon) more equivalent to counts.

(I believe the English started importing the title 'Duke' in the fourteenth century, thus somewhat imitating continental terms, but the 'duchies' they created then were a bit different than the old duchies of the early Middle Ages.)

Wikipedia has a reasonably good page on it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl
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Offline Peter R

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Re: Provinces of Rhakhaan
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2018, 11:04:16 AM »


I'm starting to think that the next item I need to purchase for my RPG collection is a shrink wrapping machine! Even though I've gone berserk with PDF purchases, I still have quite a lot of stuff from the late 70s to early 90s. Most used admittedly (apart from a couple of MERP modules that I never opened back in the day and now don't want to), and some with scribbles in, but still...

Just say they must have been the designer's copies and those are their margin notes from the development and playtesting days.  You must have been sent the originals by mistake.

Given that it's my handwriting, most of the scribbles could be anything. I can't read my handwriting, it's that bad. I should have been a doctor...
It's not bad, it is just encrypted.
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