Topic: Whats your favorite house rule?

[Cory Magel]

Based on every RM user I recall talking to about it (rough ballpark) I'd be surprised if more then 1/4th of RM users pay any real attention to exhaustion points.

I had a list of things I thought they should do with a new RM and getting rid of them was one of the items or, at least, alter how they are used dramatically.

[Marrethiel]

lol, yeah we don't use Exhaustion points unless it is a long distance affair.
Which of course reminds me of a house rule that we dropped so long ago it has been forgotten about. We don't give penalties to characters for use or Power Points, Hit Points or Exhaustion Points.
Generally we feel that if you have used a significant amount of these then the characters are already "damaged" and at negatives so they don't need more. If casters had to make more rolls (thus a highter chance of failing) once they've used 25% (is that the number) of their PP's then the party would just pull out of a dungeon earlier. RM casting is random enough as it is.

[Marrethiel]

...or, at least, alter how they are used dramatically.

We have on occasion used a Space Master rule for ammunition. That is you don't have to bother keeping track of ammunition, it is too much book keeping. Instead you run out of ammo when you fumble your attack role. It is good justification. You can get results that seem a little odd at times, like when you fumble your first roll. This is then described as bad or faulty ammo, not that you've run out.
Similarly we have experimented with using this for PP's, Hits and Exhaustion. It definately adds an air of tension, knowing that you can get knocked out on any blow. However, you get reports in the news all the time where people get killed with one punch.

[Cory Magel]

So, I'm going to dump a list of most my personal house rules (just short descriptions) that I'm going to use in my own campaign (when I finally get it moving).  Some of these we've used previously, some are new.  It'll be interesting to see how they work.  Might give some ideas...

1. No experience points.  I tell you when to level.

2. Everyman = +1% per skill level. Occupational = +2% per skill level.

3. Everyone get's 100 DP at first and 80 DP there on out.

4. Everyone starts with 5 Fate Points.  They can only be used in certain death situations (subject to sensible interpretation).
    You get Fate Points by making a foe spend one.  Only certain NPC's will have Fate Points.

5. The round has been fairly dramatically altered.
    A. Roll 1d10+(Ag/Qu/In) for moving and (Re/Me/SD) for mental actions.
    B. Worst initiative moves first, best initiative moves last.
    C. Combat declarations made.
    D. Best initiative acts first, worst initiative acts last.

6. Instants:
-   Defensive instant spells take no percentage of action.
-   Defensive instant spells do not count towards the One Spell Per Round rule.
-   You may only cast one offensive instant per round.
-   You can cast as many defensive instants as you like each round.
        o   Instants cannot be stacked for more effect on the same ‘target’.
-   Instant spells need not be declared if…
        o   You are not in melee combat.
        o   You are targeting your current foe or an action that foe is performing.
        o   You are in melee combat and roll a successful Situational Awareness: Combat check.

7. Snap/Normal/Deliberate actions: Making a “snap” action simulates attempting to perform your action quicker by sacrificing effectiveness in your action.  A “snap” action will add +2 to your initiative, but give a -20% penalty to your action.
Making a “deliberate” action simulates attempting to perform an action more skillfully by taking ones time in performing it.  A “deliberate” action will impose a -2 penalty to your initiative total, but will provide a +10% bonus to your action.

8. Overcasting: You can overpay when casting a spell to raise its effective level. This means if you cast an “Open Locks” spell on a magic lock that is 4th level but use 10 PP to do it instead of the normal four, then the lock you are casting it on would resist against a 10th level spell instead of a 4th. You cannot overcast beyond your level (meaning you would need to be 10th level to spend 10 points on a 4th level spell

9. Adrenal Skills:
-   Non-passive Adrenal Maneuvers require 10% activity to perform unless otherwise specified.
-   Only one non-passive Adrenal Maneuver can be performed in a given round.
-   Non-passive Adrenal Maneuvers that are performed undeclared penalize the next action by 10%
-   Adrenal Defense is passive in nature once the stance has been assumed and does not require a percentage of activity for the remainder of the current engagement.

Therefore a character utilizing Adrenal Defence could still make an Adrenal Strength maneuver, however a character could not perform Adrenal Strength and Adrenal Speed in the same round.

10.  Making more than one attack:
      A. DUAL ATTACKS: Dual Attacks are when a character is using a weapon that can effectively be used to attack with more than one point. The Quarterstaff, Three Section Staff, and some “Pole” weapons are good examples.  Dual Attacks are commonly the result of Fighting Styles.
      B. MULTIPLE ATTACKS: Multiple Attacks are when a character has specialized in a weapon to the degree that they can effectively make more than one attack per attack action.  This is sometimes simulated by increased base damage, secondary and potentially even tertiary criticals.  Multiple Attacks are commonly the result of Weapon Specialization in a specific weapon.  (Note: Characters may not specialize in more than two specific weapons).
      C: TWO-WEAPON COMBO: Off hand with the same weapon must be developed as a separate skill unless the player has the Ambidexterity talent.
       -   Using two weapons of the same length longer then a short sword (roughly 2 feet) will result in a -10 penalty on the secondary weapon.
       -   The two attacks can be split between two opponents with a -20 penalty to both.
       -   When Parrying the OB used to do so applies to both weapons (and foes if split).
       -   For ease and speed of game combat both attacks, which are rolled separately, are resolved at the same time. This is resolved as one attack action (60%-100% activity) and a Bladeturn spell would apply to both swings.

11. Shields
-   Shield bonuses can be applied to all foes within the characters forward arc (hex immediately in front of and the two to either side of it).
-   If the character is focusing all of his or her shielding attention towards a single ranged attacker the character gains +10DB against that attacker.
-   If it has been trained in as a weapon you can make a Shield Bash attempt and still use the shield defensively, however you will be using Two-Weapon Combo rules to accomplish this.
-   A small buckler can be used with a two-handed weapon, however is useless against ranged attacks unless the character possess a skill which allows for missile parries (and is only effective when actively using that skill).
-   DB = Buckler +5 / Small Shield +10 / Medium Shield +15 / Large Shield +20 / Target Shield +25

12. Specialized Weapon Styles.
      I'm not going to go into detail here, but my weapon styles are roughly built like a spell list and your exhaustion points are basically your power points.  You can only specialize in two of the styles.  The styles are: 1-Handed Weapon/Free Hand, 1-Handed Weapon/Shield, 1-Handed Weapon/1-Handed Weapon, 2-Handed Weapon, Pole Weapon, Drawn Missile, Triggered Missile, and Thrown.

[Thom @ ICE]

In regards to Exhaustion points, what if (this is just a concept for something I am playing with) extreme exertion/special maneuvers your Base Hits are reduced.  Similar in concept to using Power Points to cast spells. You reduce your Hits when you execute extreme physical maneuvers - running long distances, holding your breath for a long time, making an incredibly long leap over a chasm, or diving from a great height...    Basically anything that the character would normally have to catch their breath after.

It would be temporary damage that you recover from quickly with a little rest, but until then you are more vulnerable.  This would then open the door to Power Strikes that do increased damage, but weaken you a little bit for the effort.    Just a thought....


Note - some of this is a spinoff from Cory's comments about Weapon Styles

[Cory Magel]

I like that idea.  Basically your hits are endurance points, but hits spent in that manner are recovered easier/faster.

One question... if you went down after using some hits this way how would to treat the immediate circumstance?  Are you still obviously conscious but just too tired/beat to do anything but lay there?  Are you unconscious?  What if they keep attacking you, how to you contribute those points towards being dead or not?  I'd be inclined to say you are unconscious, but that technically you still have those hits for sheer physical damage that may still be dealt to you while unconscious.

[Marrethiel]

In regards to Exhaustion points, what if (this is just a concept for something I am playing with) extreme exertion/special maneuvers your Base Hits are reduced.  Similar in concept to using Power Points to cast spells. You reduce your Hits when you execute extreme physical maneuvers - running long distances, holding your breath for a long time, making an incredibly long leap over a chasm, or diving from a great height...    Basically anything that the character would normally have to catch their breath after.

It would be temporary damage that you recover from quickly with a little rest, but until then you are more vulnerable.  This would then open the door to Power Strikes that do increased damage, but weaken you a little bit for the effort.    Just a thought....

I don't like the idea that you can conceivably pull off the best MM of the campaign and then die from hit loss, I guess as long as it can't kill you.
However, how about PP's instead? It is an "inner reserve" to a certain extent...

@ Cory re Overcasting:
Does this mean that Base Spell casting level is the spell level not the character level?
One of the charts I like most in RMSS is the spell casting one where you can wait up to 9 rounds to reduce penalties or increase bonus'. I think it'd be cool to be able to use this in conjunction with your overcasting rule. Then again, I think mages in my group would just run out of PP's quicker

[Frabby]

In regards to Exhaustion points, what if (this is just a concept for something I am playing with) extreme exertion/special maneuvers your Base Hits are reduced.  Similar in concept to using Power Points to cast spells. You reduce your Hits when you execute extreme physical maneuvers - running long distances, holding your breath for a long time, making an incredibly long leap over a chasm, or diving from a great height...    Basically anything that the character would normally have to catch their breath after.

It would be temporary damage that you recover from quickly with a little rest, but until then you are more vulnerable.  This would then open the door to Power Strikes that do increased damage, but weaken you a little bit for the effort.    Just a thought....

I've been thinking along the same lines. As the definition Hit Points as a vague body condition indicator already trespasses into Exhaustion Points territory.

In our group, some GMs have occasionally used Exhaustion but in the long run we felt it was too much bookkeeping to keep track of. We decided to drop it altogether, with the caveat that any GM can bring Exhaustion up again at any time during play if he feels the situation requires it - we do realize that Exhaustion is a major balancing factor and I would like to use it more, but it just hampers gameplay too much most of the time.

And regarding overcasting - wasn't that an optional rule anyways? We use it, but only once in a blue moon.

[Thom @ ICE]

It would kind of be like spellcasting... if you don't have the Hits (Power Points) available to exert then you cannot attempt the maneuver so attempting the maneuver could never knock you out directly, though it could leave you weak enough to be taken out easily.


Once you go unconscious, you are unconscious. It doesn't matter where you lost the hits from...

[Cory Magel]

@ Cory re Overcasting:
Does this mean that Base Spell casting level is the spell level not the character level?
One of the charts I like most in RMSS is the spell casting one where you can wait up to 9 rounds to reduce penalties or increase bonus'. I think it'd be cool to be able to use this in conjunction with your overcasting rule. Then again, I think mages in my group would just run out of PP's quicker

Normally something resists against a spells level, so this lets you up strength of the spell in terms of potential resistance.

My rules (especially the defensive instants ruling) can cause the characters to run themselves dry of power points very quickly, so they have to learn to be more conservative in spell usage and use better tactics.  Both the main GM's in our gaming circle always let the party 'heal/rest up' after a combat.  With me, however, they are not safe.  Mind you, I'm not going to constantly jump them... but you can't run into a wandering band of orcs, blow your wad, then rest up assuming others aren't going to show up (especially if they were scouting, patrolling, or if others just heard the commotion.

[tbigness]

I think I use most of your house rules myself except #12. I allow multiple attacks with weapon skills of 10 ranks or more as the Martial Arts multiple attack charts in Arms Law. This is for specialization skill in these weapons but penalize with an additional -10 with each attack this way.

I have also dropped one round of Prep from spell casting so it only takes 165% activity instead of 275% (I always hated the 2 round prep and 1 rd cast which made spell casting in combat frustratingly slow). I do like unlimited instant spell casting though.
I allow Spell Manipulation with extra PP cost but cannot overcome a higher level spell of the same name. I have a chart of cost in PP for improvements (Sleep V can become Sleep IX but not Sleep X for a cost of 9 PP). I don't penalize for PP use, I thought that was kinda ridiculous.

I do like the Idea of Hits loss for exertion such as sprinting, Long Distance runs, Power Maneuvers (weight lifting, power attack...), and maybe include Adrenal Maneuvers that are physical in nature.

[jdale]

1. No experience points.  I tell you when to level.
2. Everyman = +1% per skill level. Occupational = +2% per skill level.
3. Everyone get's 100 DP at first and 80 DP there on out.
4. Everyone starts with 5 Fate Points.  They can only be used in certain death situations (subject to sensible interpretation).
    You get Fate Points by making a foe spend one.  Only certain NPC's will have Fate Points.

We do the same for experience. #2 is very like RMU. #3 I kind of liked the variable DP in RMSS (it's just one more tradeoff to balance when making a character), but RMU gives fixed numbers as well. #4 I am adopting, although probably fewer than 5.

5. The round has been fairly dramatically altered.
    A. Roll 1d10+(Ag/Qu/In) for moving and (Re/Me/SD) for mental actions.
    B. Worst initiative moves first, best initiative moves last.
    C. Combat declarations made.
    D. Best initiative acts first, worst initiative acts last.

Several people have said they use different stats for initiative based on the character's actions. But how to you handle a split round? E.g. instant spell + attack, is that round physical or mental?
[/quote]

[tbigness]

I would say that is physical because of the Intent to attack, the instant would be only a small portion of the activity.

[BeggarKing (Thomas)]

We have on occasion used a Space Master rule for ammunition.

Similarly we have experimented with using this for PP's, Hits and Exhaustion. It definitely adds an air of tension, knowing that you can get knocked out on any blow. However, you get reports in the news all the time where people get killed with one punch.

I really like this idea - it leverages Rolemaster strengths and does away with mechanics that can be annoying to track. I wonder if criticals and fumbles could be expanded in a way that would take away some of the other burdensome tracking of things... it might increase the random nature of some situations but would also add tension that roll... hmm...

In regards to Exhaustion points, what if (this is just a concept for something I am playing with) extreme exertion/special maneuvers your Base Hits are reduced.

I think this is another really interesting idea. Have you tried this in play?

[Cory Magel]

I do like unlimited instant spell casting though.

You just have to make sure you qualify that as Defensive instants.  You don't want people chain casting Absolution.

4. Everyone starts with 5 Fate Points.  They can only be used in certain death situations (subject to sensible interpretation).
    You get Fate Points by making a foe spend one.  Only certain NPC's will have Fate Points.

#4 I am adopting, although probably fewer than 5.

It's rare that a player completely runs out with us.  I can't remember it actually happening to us, although people have been down to one.  I think it could have in one campaign, but the players had all agreed to make them a pool that everyone drew from.  You can always allow the purchase of them with DP or doing a mission for a church/temple/whatever or something too.

It's also nice for keeping important NPC's alive.  People always say they think their players would be mad about an NPC living through a good hit, but our group has never felt that way.  They are almost happier to have picked up an extra Fate Point.  Also better than trying to 'fudge' the result in order to keep someone alive.  I think that would be far more maddening.

Several people have said they use different stats for initiative based on the character's actions. But how to you handle a split round? E.g. instant spell + attack, is that round physical or mental?

The first half of the round isn't for 'mental' actions, but rather only movement.  The only anomaly in that is if a player is performing an action that involves movement, like using their 'Jumping' skill or casting 'Leaping*'.  So you just have to make GM calls on things like that occasionally.  The worst initiative moves first so that those with the best initiative can react to that movement.  Now, the player with the better initiative can choose to move first (you would do this in situations where you want to reach a door before the other player).  Likewise they could also choose to act last if it seemed it was going to be beneficial to them.

The point of doing the round this way is to make it run a little quicker and simpler.  I think we really only have one person that doesn't like RM rounds (he wants to play D&D, the fool) but we're doing the new round partially for his sake (I told him we are NEVER going to a round where you take all your actions at once) although it is an interesting experiment and we might adopt it completely.

Oh, and doing an instant+action.  With us the instants are instant... no initiative if the instant is defensive.  If it's offensive then I'd just use whichever action was more predominant (likely the physical one).

[Cory Magel]

We do the same for experience. #2 is very like RMU.

Oh, and this... yep.  We still do the set up front profession bonuses in RMSS (which is what we use) but Everyman and Occ in RMSS just makes diminishing returns happen quicker, so I converted them over to the RM2 (new RMU) method of profession bonuses.

That is one of the changes in RMU I was totally behind.  I think RM2 did profession bonuses better.  It is partially what's contributing to weaker starting characters in RMU (although only a portion of the reason).

[Thom @ ICE]

I think this is another really interesting idea. Have you tried this in play?

Only in mock roleplaying... where I imagine multiple PC's against multiple NPC's - combat, physical traps, etc. and the mechanics work well.  It holds up with my policy of focusing on stats and skills more than letting the dice decide. And most importantly allowing the roleplaying to be fun and heroic. 

I always heard D&D criticized for 2 battling individual just hacking at each other until hit points were reduced to 0. For me Rolemaster, and to a similar extent HARP, the combat is still very limited to "realism" and you don't get the great barbarian slashing through dozens of low level soldiers with minimal effort, or swordsman who can disarm two foes during a single round, because they are that good.  That's what I'm striving for... allowing that 20th level warrior to take out a level 1 combatant in a single swing 99% of the time, but still having that chance that the level 1 combatant can deal a death blow if the gods are with him.  So this rule (and others) try to permit those extra-special moves but they all have an impact and a risk - even if it is just a small one.  Go Simple, Go Fun, Go Heroic... that's my emphasis.  Since the concepts are modular in nature, they can still be used in RM or HARP as is with minimal tweaking.

[Peter R]

We do use the minuses for hits taken but that is the only nod to exhaustion in any of the games I have played.

[Hurin]

I like several of Cory's rules. We already do xp/levelling that way (I just tell the PCs when to level, usually at the end of a session). I also very much like Cory's overcasting rules. We also never used exhaustion points.

I'm not sure about the infinite defensive instant though; I think that could be subject to abuse. On the topic of instants, I'm not quite sure what the role of an offensive instant is: that is to say, why are any offensive spells instants? If you eliminated the instant designation from all offensive spells, then I would be fine with allowing multiple instants in a round (I would still make them a 40% action myself, but I wouldn't have any problem with people casting more than one).

I very much like Thom's idea of tying exhaustion to hit points. Could you perhaps tie this in with the fatigue system? That is to say, fail the exhaustion check and you take 1d10 hits. Then you don't have to track minuses anymore-- you just do it with hit points. Just a thought.

[intothatdarkness]

I've been using a version of Fate points for some time...actually two sets of points: one for Luck and another based on characters making their own luck. I generate Luck points for each character when they're created, and players never know how many points their character has (so your luck CAN run out...). The other points are gained each time a character levels up (so they start with one, gaining another when they reach second level, and so on). NPCs will only have the level-based variety (and even then only some NPCs).